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Are powergamers a problem and do you allow them to play in your games?
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<blockquote data-quote="5ekyu" data-source="post: 7328471" data-attributes="member: 6919838"><p>For the bolded part - the toll bridge - if the toll bridge guy has a name, is friendly sort and so on another option is not only paying for the crossing but also for information or to keep their passage secret. Any strange happenings, odd travellers, seen any folks with these robes? </p><p></p><p>That is part of the key to dealing with the PCs and the world - have they been shown these NPCs are anything to value and not just for their roleplaying indulgences but as perhaps profitable or useful contacts. The amount of "return on investment" for just paying the cross plus tip and talking can be shown to be much greater than the value of killing or scamming the NPC.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>In my experience, once "does my PC survive" becomes not at all the primary focus of the game things tend to play better in terms of interaction and a whole host of things. this is not to say you have careless or reckless PCs who just do crazy stuff, but when their goals and objectives and the events around them are what is on their mind more than say "am i gonna get killed today?" the campaign seem to thrive. </p><p></p><p><strong>Obviously the after-death game setting and table rules elements play a huge role in that point - not an aside.</strong></p><p><strong></strong> </p><p>What are the new character standards? First level cold start or new guy at current levels/gear or somewhere in between.</p><p></p><p>What are the post-dead return of that character options and are they available to the PCs yet directly, indirectly through NPCs or not at all?</p><p></p><p>Are there other aspects that can play a role even after the return from dead? Cults who view the Returned as Holy, Seers or Abominations, special abilities that unlock after a brush with the afterlife, permanent consequences such as lost death saves, lost CON or other. and even vision quests while in the beyond can all make for additional considerations when it comes to how the players approach and value the death of their PC.</p><p></p><p>But to me just as important (even more in fact) to the after-death elements are the getting dead elements - though the after-death gets most of the discussion focus it seems.</p><p></p><p>How possible or likely is a one-shot dead result?</p><p>How possible or likely is it that your character dies just by bad dice without chances beyond making the roll and how common is that?</p><p>How possible or likely is it that losing a combat creates a captured result rather than a slaughtered as a matter of course?</p><p></p><p>A game might see players treat "my character's survival" quite differently if up-front the Gm says "You wont die by dice. You might die by neglect/drama - if the PCs do not choose to get to you before death saves expire. You might die by choice or egregious stupidity - after numerous warnings you try a suicidal act with full knowledge of the consequences say. But some stray crit or failed save won't kill you - just setup the death save sequences with possible additional consequences."</p><p></p><p>I mean, to me, Disintigrate or PWK where we replace "poof/dead" with "You are at zero hp and the usual death saves kick in. However,.. Each successful death save, healing or stabilize type effect stalls the end. The process will only be stopped by healing, remove curse and restoration magic spells spent equal to the level of the original attack. AND..."</p><p>DISINTEGRATE "With each failed death save gear is lost (including one item of note."</p><p>PWK: "Each failed death save becomes permanent, forever counting against your death save totals."</p><p></p><p>These still leave those spells with serious consequences that demand more effort at the point of occurrence which seems much more drama invoking than poof dead. (one could do the same sort of thing for the massive damage rule if it were even in play.)</p><p><strong></strong></p><p><strong>But to me a **lot** of the impetus and drive for players to see "survival is winning" is created by the campaign setting decisions on death (before, during and after) the <em>group </em>decides to use for their game. </strong></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="5ekyu, post: 7328471, member: 6919838"] For the bolded part - the toll bridge - if the toll bridge guy has a name, is friendly sort and so on another option is not only paying for the crossing but also for information or to keep their passage secret. Any strange happenings, odd travellers, seen any folks with these robes? That is part of the key to dealing with the PCs and the world - have they been shown these NPCs are anything to value and not just for their roleplaying indulgences but as perhaps profitable or useful contacts. The amount of "return on investment" for just paying the cross plus tip and talking can be shown to be much greater than the value of killing or scamming the NPC. In my experience, once "does my PC survive" becomes not at all the primary focus of the game things tend to play better in terms of interaction and a whole host of things. this is not to say you have careless or reckless PCs who just do crazy stuff, but when their goals and objectives and the events around them are what is on their mind more than say "am i gonna get killed today?" the campaign seem to thrive. [B]Obviously the after-death game setting and table rules elements play a huge role in that point - not an aside. [/B] What are the new character standards? First level cold start or new guy at current levels/gear or somewhere in between. What are the post-dead return of that character options and are they available to the PCs yet directly, indirectly through NPCs or not at all? Are there other aspects that can play a role even after the return from dead? Cults who view the Returned as Holy, Seers or Abominations, special abilities that unlock after a brush with the afterlife, permanent consequences such as lost death saves, lost CON or other. and even vision quests while in the beyond can all make for additional considerations when it comes to how the players approach and value the death of their PC. But to me just as important (even more in fact) to the after-death elements are the getting dead elements - though the after-death gets most of the discussion focus it seems. How possible or likely is a one-shot dead result? How possible or likely is it that your character dies just by bad dice without chances beyond making the roll and how common is that? How possible or likely is it that losing a combat creates a captured result rather than a slaughtered as a matter of course? A game might see players treat "my character's survival" quite differently if up-front the Gm says "You wont die by dice. You might die by neglect/drama - if the PCs do not choose to get to you before death saves expire. You might die by choice or egregious stupidity - after numerous warnings you try a suicidal act with full knowledge of the consequences say. But some stray crit or failed save won't kill you - just setup the death save sequences with possible additional consequences." I mean, to me, Disintigrate or PWK where we replace "poof/dead" with "You are at zero hp and the usual death saves kick in. However,.. Each successful death save, healing or stabilize type effect stalls the end. The process will only be stopped by healing, remove curse and restoration magic spells spent equal to the level of the original attack. AND..." DISINTEGRATE "With each failed death save gear is lost (including one item of note." PWK: "Each failed death save becomes permanent, forever counting against your death save totals." These still leave those spells with serious consequences that demand more effort at the point of occurrence which seems much more drama invoking than poof dead. (one could do the same sort of thing for the massive damage rule if it were even in play.) [B] But to me a **lot** of the impetus and drive for players to see "survival is winning" is created by the campaign setting decisions on death (before, during and after) the [I]group [/I]decides to use for their game. [/B] [/QUOTE]
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