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Are Summon Monster Spells Underpowered(and how would you fix it?)
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<blockquote data-quote="mmadsen" data-source="post: 852553" data-attributes="member: 1645"><p>If we compare Lesser Planar Binding to the Summon Monster spells a few things immediately pop up. The 5th-level Lesser Planar Binding summons an 8-HD monster for days at a time, while Summon Monster V only summons a 5-HD monster for 9 rounds (less than one minute). On the other hand, Lesser Planar Binding gives the summoned creature a Will save to avoid the trap (which requires a Magic Circle) and opposed Charisma checks to ignore your requests (or break free if you roll a 1). </p><p>The more powerful 6th-level Planar Binding spell summons up to 16 HD of creatures. The 8th-level Greater Planar Binding summons up to 24 HD of creatures. </p><p></p><p>Would it be that difficult to make all summonings work this way?</p><p></p><p>I thought I'd try to piece together a simple Summon Monster spell that feels more like your classic demon summoning: <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">When the creature is summoned, it attempts a Will saving throw. If it succeeds, it returns to its own plane (or never quite arrives in the summoner's plane).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The summoned creature spends one round bargaining with its summoner. The summoner makes a Charisma check opposed by the summoned creature's Charisma check, modified (+0 to +6) for any reward offered by the summoner. If the summoned creature wins, it refuses service but remains on the summoners plane.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Depending on how much the summoner won the Charisma check by, the summoned monster will subject itself to only so much harm: 0, until threatened; 1, first blood; 5, half hit points, 10 death.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A summoned creature will only perform one task, and it won't let on to what degree it will risk its own hide. (Roll its Charisma check secretly.) It might agree to guard the evil wizard's tower, then flee as soon as our heroes attack.</li> </ul><p>To simplify things, the Will save and the opposed Charisma check could get folded into one opposed Will check, or we could just drop the Will save entirely. </p><p></p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="mmadsen, post: 852553, member: 1645"] If we compare Lesser Planar Binding to the Summon Monster spells a few things immediately pop up. The 5th-level Lesser Planar Binding summons an 8-HD monster for days at a time, while Summon Monster V only summons a 5-HD monster for 9 rounds (less than one minute). On the other hand, Lesser Planar Binding gives the summoned creature a Will save to avoid the trap (which requires a Magic Circle) and opposed Charisma checks to ignore your requests (or break free if you roll a 1). The more powerful 6th-level Planar Binding spell summons up to 16 HD of creatures. The 8th-level Greater Planar Binding summons up to 24 HD of creatures. Would it be that difficult to make all summonings work this way? I thought I'd try to piece together a simple Summon Monster spell that feels more like your classic demon summoning:[List][*]When the creature is summoned, it attempts a Will saving throw. If it succeeds, it returns to its own plane (or never quite arrives in the summoner's plane).[*]The summoned creature spends one round bargaining with its summoner. The summoner makes a Charisma check opposed by the summoned creature's Charisma check, modified (+0 to +6) for any reward offered by the summoner. If the summoned creature wins, it refuses service but remains on the summoners plane.[*]Depending on how much the summoner won the Charisma check by, the summoned monster will subject itself to only so much harm: 0, until threatened; 1, first blood; 5, half hit points, 10 death.[*]A summoned creature will only perform one task, and it won't let on to what degree it will risk its own hide. (Roll its Charisma check secretly.) It might agree to guard the evil wizard's tower, then flee as soon as our heroes attack.[/List] To simplify things, the Will save and the opposed Charisma check could get folded into one opposed Will check, or we could just drop the Will save entirely. Thoughts? [/QUOTE]
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