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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 9191956" data-attributes="member: 18">You wrote this whole post, then essentially confirmed what I'm saying.Good thing I didn't think or suggest that, isn't it?If you insist on suggesting I said things I didn't say then I guess this discussion is over. But if not there's the below:What I suggested was that many writers are great, and many are not. I was very clear on that. I have been twice now, but you're continuing to ignore that. No-one disagrees that Hollywood has some amazing writers - but it also has a lot of very questionable writers, who seem to find frequent employment!Also, I would push back extremely hard myself on the notion that being Harvard-educated with a writing-related degree means you are a good writer. That's putting the cart before the horse and I say this knowing multiple people who went to Harvard, various other Ivy League colleges and course countless who went to Oxbridge including two writers. That means you are an educated writer with incredible potential connections (as provided by being at Harvard, being a member of societies and so on), your work determines whether you are a good writer. Many of the greatest writers in Hollywood history had questionable or limited formal writing education, and I'm not seeing any strong trend that Harvard or Yale produce particularly good writers in Hollywood. Are you?It's definitely of note that Marvel have repeatedly hired people with Harvard or similar backgrounds to write for them, and I don't know how people in the US feel about it, but generally repeatedly hiring people with Oxbridge backgrounds in the UK is seen as somewhat suspect, as more about the excellent connections one gains from these institutions than anything else. Again I say that having such connections - I mean hell, Snarf, two people from my classes in high school are name Hollywood movie actors (one a big name), two more are on TV shows you've probably seen.I would also push back somewhat on the notion that having a script on the Black List means you are a good writer generally either. It's a much better indicator than the educational institute you went to, for sure, because it means that a significant number of people in Hollywood at least read and liked one of your scripts - and if we look at list of actually-produced Black List scripts, we see a high rate of quality for sure. The problem is that's one script - there's no guarantee that your next is of the same quality.As a prime example of the latter, we might look at Eternals. Is anyone suggesting Eternals was a well-written film? Are you suggesting that? I ask because you made this part of your argument. I would suggest that it was a fairly bad script in most ways a script can be bad. It's poorly-paced, the plotting doesn't make a lot of sense and contradicts itself in obvious ways (though it's not nonsensical either), the dialogue has moments of wit but also an entire junkyard of clunky dialogue and repeated uses of poorly-constructed exposition. And that's not even the half of it. Yet the people who wrote the story and the original screenplay where the Firpos, who have a Black List script (and I think a particularly well-regarded one, Ruin - not my name, the name of the script!). I should note that Chloe Zhao and Patrick Burleigh are also credited for the actual screenplay used, so I guess it's possible that the script was once good and the director and Burleigh ruined it somehow. But to me that seems unlikely - I doubt it was ever a great script - the basic construction is questionable.I wouldn't categorize the Firpos or most Black List people as the "never voluntarily read a book after college" type of writer though to be clear.To respond to your other post - I quite agree that other factors than merely bad writing can ruin a script, but your position seems, superficially, to be that it's everyone's fault but the writers. That is presumably not right?</blockquote>

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