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General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Are things like Intimidate/Bluff/Diplomacy too easy?
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<blockquote data-quote="Krensky" data-source="post: 5610155" data-attributes="member: 30936"><p>I doubt it will matter since you appear to keep ignoring people's replies, but sure.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>THEY DIDN'T FAIL!</p><p></p><p>The guard believed them. The guard reacted based on that. That he didn't react the way the PCs wanted is the nature of the game.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Did they fail at all? - no.</p><p>Did something unexpected happen? - yes.</p><p>Did the PCs potentially screw up by not preparing properly and choosing the wrong lie or tactic? - yes.</p><p>Will the players have fun dancing and trying to fix the situation? - They do at my table. Then again, they actually want a GM. Under your argument, the GM is superflous because the players get to define what a success or failure is.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Who said they would be caught? They made their Bluff check. The guard believes their lie. They do not get to dictate how the guard reacts. I don't tell them what their characters do, they don't get to tell me what my NPCs do. Heck, they don't even get full control over their NPCs.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, they didn't fail. The guard believed them. That the guard did not react the way they wanted to his belief is not a failure.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Then that's their failing. If they believe that, at first level, they can walk into an ancient dragon's lair, call him names, moon him, and then kick his ass, is it the GMs fault when they're slaughtered?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, they didn't fail. They made their Bluff check. The guard believed their story.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>All of those things can and do happen. Honestly, are you actually reading our replies? They succeeded at their Bluff. The guard believes them. What happens then is not under their control.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You're the only one describing it as a failure. They succeeded. There's no Monkey's Paw. There's manipulating the results. There's no railroading. They tried to lie to the guard. They succeeded. There is no evil bad wrong GM here. The players are not in control of the world. NPCs not reacting how the players want is not a railroad.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Krensky, post: 5610155, member: 30936"] I doubt it will matter since you appear to keep ignoring people's replies, but sure. THEY DIDN'T FAIL! The guard believed them. The guard reacted based on that. That he didn't react the way the PCs wanted is the nature of the game. Did they fail at all? - no. Did something unexpected happen? - yes. Did the PCs potentially screw up by not preparing properly and choosing the wrong lie or tactic? - yes. Will the players have fun dancing and trying to fix the situation? - They do at my table. Then again, they actually want a GM. Under your argument, the GM is superflous because the players get to define what a success or failure is. Who said they would be caught? They made their Bluff check. The guard believes their lie. They do not get to dictate how the guard reacts. I don't tell them what their characters do, they don't get to tell me what my NPCs do. Heck, they don't even get full control over their NPCs. Again, they didn't fail. The guard believed them. That the guard did not react the way they wanted to his belief is not a failure. Then that's their failing. If they believe that, at first level, they can walk into an ancient dragon's lair, call him names, moon him, and then kick his ass, is it the GMs fault when they're slaughtered? Again, they didn't fail. They made their Bluff check. The guard believed their story. All of those things can and do happen. Honestly, are you actually reading our replies? They succeeded at their Bluff. The guard believes them. What happens then is not under their control. You're the only one describing it as a failure. They succeeded. There's no Monkey's Paw. There's manipulating the results. There's no railroading. They tried to lie to the guard. They succeeded. There is no evil bad wrong GM here. The players are not in control of the world. NPCs not reacting how the players want is not a railroad. [/QUOTE]
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Are things like Intimidate/Bluff/Diplomacy too easy?
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