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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Krensky" data-source="post: 5611545" data-attributes="member: 30936">Hussar, seriously?Are you willfully ignoring what we've written in favor of what you want us to have said?You almost have to be, because we're not saying that. Everytime you bring it up, we keep telling you that that isn't what we're saying.Once again:The PCs made their Bluff check. The guard believes them.They succeeded in the check, regardless of what happens then.Why? Because they rolled to tell a lie. That''s all the check covers. It doesn't mean they get to exert some metagame narrative control over the game. I just means they told a lie successfully.Read that again. We'll wait.Now, making the guard believe them does not give them any control or agency over the guard's actions or the world. If they want to directly influence the NPC's actions and convince him to do something specifically, there are skills for that. Bluff is not one of them. It's like saying I'm going to roll a Crafting to jump over a ditch.Some lies might get them in. Some lies might get them attacked. Some lies might simply complicate things. Determining what the guard (an NPC) does with the information is not up to the players or their view on what is reasonable. Oh, your counter example? Boring. My players would laugh at me. I can draw months of gaming out of the guard calling for reinforcements and the PCs running and hiding. The PC in question's face appears on wanted posters. The real Merry Prankster shows up, maybe he's amused, maybe he's angry, maybe he just wants to thank the PC for his stupidity and taking the heat off him.Tons of additional threads and beats.Yours would result in the guard being knocked out, tied up and the players forgetting about it before the session was over.I set up my games and scenarios so the PCs have to screw up by the numbers and then make things even worse for them to 'fail'. Why? Because I want them to succeed. I don't necessarily want them to know it while in the thick of it though. I want them convinced I'm out to kill their characters and use their sheets as fire-starters. I revel in joking about my (non-existent) viking hat, laughing like a bad pulp villain, and randomly rolling dice behind my wall of fear and ignorance. It's an act. Hell, my players know me well enough to know it's an act. When they're thinking about it, that is.You know what though? My players still win. Their characters are bruised. They're battered. They've sacrificed and bled and fought their utmost. They almost died repeatedly. They pulled through in the end, saved the damsel (or boytoy or whatever), spiked the villain's head down the temple steps, and have piles of silver and valuables to spend on ale and whores (or rare books, or whatever).That is what makes a memorable, exciting campaign.At least for me and my players.</blockquote>

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