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Message: <blockquote data-quote="JamesonCourage" data-source="post: 5613107" data-attributes="member: 6668292">Alrighty then <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />They players can say "I want to make sure it's not fake" and I'll give them every check that's reasonable and applicable. If they don't say they want to check it, however, then I don't give it to them for free.You do know I'm JC, right? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Haha, maybe you're right <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Indeed. If the players make a tactical mistake, I don't negate it with simply high rolls. This includes both combat and social encounters.No, he's not wrong. However, he's said that if the guard passes the buck up, then the PCs therefore engage in a chain of skill checks that only ends once the PCs fail. That's false, and I don't know where he got it.Maybe you don't know I'm JC <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />The players have a very real chance of messing up tactically and socially. I had a level 8 party attack a group of about 20 level 2 fighters once. The party was on the ground, at the base of a mountain. The level 2 fighters were on a steep incline, waiting to ambush them. They had barrels of slick grease, crossbows, and the like, and they used that tactical advantage to devastating effect against the party (the party had to retreat, and 3 out of 5 PCs were bleeding out, but were healed in time).Just like in combat, players can make bad social decisions. Impersonating the diplomat turned out to be such a decision. And I don't know why I have to say it again, but many other tactics could have worked there. The PCs screwed up, and it got them into some trouble, just like with the level 2 fighters on the mountainside.Well, in 3.5, I think they are. I changed them in my game. That is, I changed Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate. They're all different, because I saw problems with all of them. But, I also completely gutted Craft, etc., so I'm pretty picky.Which is why I think playing by RAW is the counter balance. But, that's my personal opinion, and by no means do I think it should extend to every table.Exactly.Exactly <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />I agree with this, really. Social skills, like Bluff, are only tools in seeing how successful you are, but player decision and tactics, be they in combat or social encounters, makes a huge difference.As always, play what you like <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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