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<blockquote data-quote="Gothmog" data-source="post: 2528503" data-attributes="member: 317">I choose option E- they are pathetic.&nbsp; Very unfortunate actually.&nbsp; Undead in 1E were somewhat scary, and in 2E slightly less so.&nbsp; 3E completely neutered undead though- they are now no more than monsters of a given CR to beat up and take their stuff.&nbsp; I'm sorry, but even in a world rife with magic and the surpernatural, undead are UNNATURAL and counter to life, sanity, and the natural order.&nbsp; Because they are really no more than hunks of meat with no vitals (if corporeal) or ectoplasm (if incorporeal), undead should be EXTREMELY resistant to damage or destruction.&nbsp; Yet in D&amp;D they have none of these characteristics.&nbsp; Granted, a lot of the scariness of undead hinges on a good GM and description, but its really anti-climactic when you've spent all this time working up a mood, then the PCs just wade in and whack undead like they were cannon-fodder.&nbsp; I know this was a common occurrance when we started playing 3E and the PCs realized undead were no more dangerous (and sometimes much less dangerous) than other critters of the same CR.Actually, in most games undead are pretty laughable.&nbsp; The only game I've ever seen them really be scary in was Kult, but that game is just twisted and weird (in a mostly good way) on a lot of levels.&nbsp; I've house ruled that ALL undead cause fear within a radius of 10' x HD (Will save 10 + 1/2 HD + Cha mod DC, and badly failing the fear check can result in temporary or permanent insanity), they always have max hp, they have at least DR 5/- (10/- if more than 10 HD) to reflect their unnatural toughness, their BAB is equal to a cleric's, and intelligent undead ALWAYS have at least one other ability appropriate for how they were created that varies between each creature.&nbsp; Doing those things, never giving completely clear descriptions of exactly what kind of undead the PCs face, and playing up the spookiness of an undead encounter has put the fear of undead back in my PCs.&nbsp; The mention of shadows or ghouls will send the 10th-11th level party I run a campaign for right now running for their lives!&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool&nbsp; &nbsp; :cool:"&nbsp; data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" /></blockquote>

[QUOTE="Gothmog, post: 2528503, member: 317"] I choose option E- they are pathetic. Very unfortunate actually. Undead in 1E were somewhat scary, and in 2E slightly less so. 3E completely neutered undead though- they are now no more than monsters of a given CR to beat up and take their stuff. I'm sorry, but even in a world rife with magic and the surpernatural, undead are UNNATURAL and counter to life, sanity, and the natural order. Because they are really no more than hunks of meat with no vitals (if corporeal) or ectoplasm (if incorporeal), undead should be EXTREMELY resistant to damage or destruction. Yet in D&D they have none of these characteristics. Granted, a lot of the scariness of undead hinges on a good GM and description, but its really anti-climactic when you've spent all this time working up a mood, then the PCs just wade in and whack undead like they were cannon-fodder. I know this was a common occurrance when we started playing 3E and the PCs realized undead were no more dangerous (and sometimes much less dangerous) than other critters of the same CR. Actually, in most games undead are pretty laughable. The only game I've ever seen them really be scary in was Kult, but that game is just twisted and weird (in a mostly good way) on a lot of levels. I've house ruled that ALL undead cause fear within a radius of 10' x HD (Will save 10 + 1/2 HD + Cha mod DC, and badly failing the fear check can result in temporary or permanent insanity), they always have max hp, they have at least DR 5/- (10/- if more than 10 HD) to reflect their unnatural toughness, their BAB is equal to a cleric's, and intelligent undead ALWAYS have at least one other ability appropriate for how they were created that varies between each creature. Doing those things, never giving completely clear descriptions of exactly what kind of undead the PCs face, and playing up the spookiness of an undead encounter has put the fear of undead back in my PCs. The mention of shadows or ghouls will send the 10th-11th level party I run a campaign for right now running for their lives! :cool: [/QUOTE]

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