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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GreyICE" data-source="post: 6004933" data-attributes="member: 6684526">The Defender scale---Top Tier---Fighter (every CharOp 'ultimate defender' ends up multiclassing Fighter for their sexy feats)Knight (possibly best defender currently although DM is allowed to throw book at you if you abuse them)---Mid Tier---PaladinWardenSwordmage ---Battlemind Tier---Battlemind (unless ruthlessly optimized, then rises to mid-tier)Cool, for two encounters per day they're ridiculously sticky unless you have anyone who attacks in melee.  Meanwhile for infinity encounters per day a Fighter can lock down 1/2 to 3/4ths of the monsters at any given point, and let the party handle the rest.  And that's really all you need.  I've tried to optimize the Warden, I've taken him to some pretty ridiculous limits, but you still come back to the fact that you're jumping through hoops while the fighter can afford to be sticky AND do other things by virtue of having a ridiculously sticky feature as his "Defender Power."Wardens are still tougher than houses and are an HP nightmare with Surge values that can trivialize immense amounts of damage, and... *sigh*You know what? 4E is roughly balanced.  Maybe an optimized party would rather have a fighter, but it's close enough you won't see the 3E Wizard/Fighter dichotomy if you bring a Warden over one.  But yeah, Wardens are definitely balanced.(Side note: If you have a DM who thinks monsters should run over to the defender and proceed to try and beat him into a pile of dust, Warden is probably overpowered as they're the hands-down best defender at taking damage like a pro)</blockquote>

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