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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Nail" data-source="post: 2582572" data-attributes="member: 224">and now for a COMPLETELY off-topic post........sorry, OP!!The dragon doesn't get any "melee immunity".  Okay, think this through:One party member casts Greater Dispel Magic, and takes care of all (or nearly all) a dragon's buffs, as the dragon's caster level sucks.Meanwhile, the rest of the party goes to town on the dragon.The bottom line advantage is pretty straight forward: the party simply gets more actions than the dragon does.  Anywhere from 4 to 7 times the number of actions.  (Our party has 7 players => 7 PCs.)Given that our party attacked with surprise, and half of us won initiative during the 1st round, that's a heck of a lot of more actions than the dragon gets. And again: we didn't attack him when he was prepared.  We attacked him when we were prepared.  Big difference.   As an aside: Do you, as a player, ever get to attack the bad guys on your own terms?  I think that might be a campaign-specific problem.  I'm not casting aspersions, here.  Just curious.It's in the CD.  Keep in mind, I've been able to convert practically all my fellow PCs to my Clr's religion.  That helps alot.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Agreed.  I'll readily admit the dragon was not as prepared as he could have been.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  And for the record, this was from a published adventure, so we can't blame my DM for not equiping the dragon properly.Also for the record: ain't no way we found more than a couple thousand gp worth of treasure in the Black Dragon Wyrm's lair.  Our rogue just about had an aneurism when we found out....  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />(Trying to bring thread back to rogue topic.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  )</blockquote>

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