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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Armor as Damage Reduction (how to make it work for you)
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<blockquote data-quote="Spatzimaus" data-source="post: 1274779" data-attributes="member: 3051"><p>I'd make a few small suggestions/bring up a few issues.</p><p></p><p>1> Right now, your EC is basically your flat-footed AC and your AC is the touch AC (minus 10, plus DR).</p><p>You can move Deflection over to AC, by saying that it's slowing down incoming attacks. Likewise, Shield and Cover AC should move over to EC, since they're more about preventing a blow from reaching your body in the first place.</p><p>This way, being flat-footed reduces both AC and EC, and the same for touch attacks.</p><p></p><p>2> Critical hits will now be WAY more common, since the confirmation rolls won't need to roll nearly as high.</p><p>Likewise, all of those "if I hit you I do X" abilities become way more powerful. That includes poison, disease, Sneak Attack, bonus damage dice from Flaming/Frost/Shock; unless it was delivered by a touch attack before, it'll now be stronger. Take Sneak Attack for example; if I'm attacking someone in full plate they'll have a low EC, I'll hit pretty much automatically, and my +9d6 sneak attack will easily blow through any armor or natural armor they have; in the core rules I'd be far less likely to hit.</p><p>Suggestion: only apply any of these bonus damage sources (including crits) if the base damage (weapon + STR bonus + enhancement) wasn't reduced to 0 by the AC.</p><p></p><p>3> On the other hand, against something with a high AC your only real option is to Power Attack, which ranged attackers can't do; you won't have any problem hitting the target (a dragon with AC of 2?), but damage is a different story. How does an archer defeat the 30+ point DR your larger dragons would now have? Someone in Full Plate would totally ignore any arrows fired at him (which totally goes against reality; longbow >> full plate)</p><p></p><p>Possible suggestion: move Natural Armor back over to EC, to separate it from armor AC; dragons would now be hard to hit again. It's not realistic, though, and it still has many of the same problems.</p><p>OR, make an "overflow" rule, where every 2 points you exceed the EC by adds +1 to your damage rolls. It's not as efficient as Power Attack, but you don't have to decide beforehand.</p><p></p><p>4> Add a little variability to the "armor bonus" AC to reflect an armor's vulnerable spots, by replacing the flat +X with 2dX. For example, Full Plate would be 2d8; anywhere from 2 to 16 with a mean of 9. Odd sizes get awkward (to roll a d5, do you take half of a d10, or a d6 where you reroll any 6's?).</p><p>Without this, daggers will never be useful against full plate; this way, there's always a chance the defender rolls low. Possibly you could explicitly list the set of dice for each type, to reflect that some armors are more uniform than others; chainmail might be 2d4 and breastplate is 1d8, to reflect that the chain is more consistently average but a BP is more all-or-nothing; this'd also allow you to avoid the awkward die sizes.</p><p></p><p>4.5> If you want to make daggers and such useful without adding rolling for everyone else, just say this:</p><p>"When using a finessable weapon (see the Weapon Finesse feat) or any bow, the armor DR is reduced from +X to +1dX. Armors with the Fortification ability neutralize this in the same way they do critical hits or sneak attacks."</p><p></p><p>Finessable weapons are pretty much limited to light blades and the rapier. You could possibly make this variability a Feat for an attacker, a sort of "find weak point" ability, with Weapon Finesse as a prerequisite.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Spatzimaus, post: 1274779, member: 3051"] I'd make a few small suggestions/bring up a few issues. 1> Right now, your EC is basically your flat-footed AC and your AC is the touch AC (minus 10, plus DR). You can move Deflection over to AC, by saying that it's slowing down incoming attacks. Likewise, Shield and Cover AC should move over to EC, since they're more about preventing a blow from reaching your body in the first place. This way, being flat-footed reduces both AC and EC, and the same for touch attacks. 2> Critical hits will now be WAY more common, since the confirmation rolls won't need to roll nearly as high. Likewise, all of those "if I hit you I do X" abilities become way more powerful. That includes poison, disease, Sneak Attack, bonus damage dice from Flaming/Frost/Shock; unless it was delivered by a touch attack before, it'll now be stronger. Take Sneak Attack for example; if I'm attacking someone in full plate they'll have a low EC, I'll hit pretty much automatically, and my +9d6 sneak attack will easily blow through any armor or natural armor they have; in the core rules I'd be far less likely to hit. Suggestion: only apply any of these bonus damage sources (including crits) if the base damage (weapon + STR bonus + enhancement) wasn't reduced to 0 by the AC. 3> On the other hand, against something with a high AC your only real option is to Power Attack, which ranged attackers can't do; you won't have any problem hitting the target (a dragon with AC of 2?), but damage is a different story. How does an archer defeat the 30+ point DR your larger dragons would now have? Someone in Full Plate would totally ignore any arrows fired at him (which totally goes against reality; longbow >> full plate) Possible suggestion: move Natural Armor back over to EC, to separate it from armor AC; dragons would now be hard to hit again. It's not realistic, though, and it still has many of the same problems. OR, make an "overflow" rule, where every 2 points you exceed the EC by adds +1 to your damage rolls. It's not as efficient as Power Attack, but you don't have to decide beforehand. 4> Add a little variability to the "armor bonus" AC to reflect an armor's vulnerable spots, by replacing the flat +X with 2dX. For example, Full Plate would be 2d8; anywhere from 2 to 16 with a mean of 9. Odd sizes get awkward (to roll a d5, do you take half of a d10, or a d6 where you reroll any 6's?). Without this, daggers will never be useful against full plate; this way, there's always a chance the defender rolls low. Possibly you could explicitly list the set of dice for each type, to reflect that some armors are more uniform than others; chainmail might be 2d4 and breastplate is 1d8, to reflect that the chain is more consistently average but a BP is more all-or-nothing; this'd also allow you to avoid the awkward die sizes. 4.5> If you want to make daggers and such useful without adding rolling for everyone else, just say this: "When using a finessable weapon (see the Weapon Finesse feat) or any bow, the armor DR is reduced from +X to +1dX. Armors with the Fortification ability neutralize this in the same way they do critical hits or sneak attacks." Finessable weapons are pretty much limited to light blades and the rapier. You could possibly make this variability a Feat for an attacker, a sort of "find weak point" ability, with Weapon Finesse as a prerequisite. [/QUOTE]
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