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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Man in the Funny Hat" data-source="post: 2803316" data-attributes="member: 32740">Not so.  The idea of a no-win that is being discussed is a situation where the DM intends that there is no correct resolution.  If he faces you with choosing whether to save your wife or mother from certain death a no-win scenario is one where REGARDLESS OF WHAT YOU ATTEMPT TO DO, ONE OF THEM -WILL- DIE.  If the DM intends to allow success at saving both, but that it will rely upon the precise nature of the attempt then it is no longer a no-win.The Kobayashi Maru scenario from Trek is an excellent example because was intended to be a no-win scenario as noted above.  Savik's first run at it she complains that it is an unfair test of her command abilities BECAUSE there was no way to win.  Kirks first response to her is, "A no-win situation is something every commander might face, don't you think?  So now you have something new to think about."  His eventual clarification to her is that there ISN'T a correct resolution because it is a test of CHARACTER - to see how the candidate reacts to death, to a situation where there truly is no hope.  They are interested in the reaction in and of itself; to see the qualities of the individual beyond the mere proficiency of their established training.  Do they just give up and not try?  Do they get angry?  Do they try wild and outrageous things or continue to follow "uncreative" tactics?  In a Starfleet training program for command officers it is a valuable tool because those reactions would help reveal the kind of command the trainee is best suited for.  In D&D it has no place because it isn't necessary for the DM to do anything more than ask the player to describe their characters state of mind; to explain what motivations the character may have for doing this instead of that; etc.Difficult choices with inevitable and equally distasteful outcomes will arise in D&D of their own accord - do I save the NPC child about to be eaten by the monster 20' to the West, or do I save my unconscious PC comrade Wolfgar 20' to the East by giving him a healing potion lest he die irrevocably at the end of the round?  The DM does not need to ENGINEER these moments with the specified intent that the PC who is faced with the choice "lose" regardless of what he does.  You may as well use the random blue-bolts-from-the-heavens for all the purpose such an exercise serves.</blockquote>

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