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Message: <blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 6685013" data-attributes="member: 2067">It doesn't really, by the RAW.Vision is a binary thing - either you can be seen clearly, or you can't. That's entirely separate from if you are stealthed or not. If you can be fully seen, you can't stealth (against the creatures that can see you). If there were some ability that allowed you to stealth when you can be seen, presumably success on that roll wouldn't also make you invisible, it would just mean that even though you can be seen, creatures you beat on your Stealth check don't know you're there. Creatures who did beat your Stealth check would see you normally. If there's dim light or darkness or cover or somesuch, you can't be clearly seen, so you can stealth. If you don't try to stealth in dim light, there's no problem - folks can see basically where you are, and they can attack you normally. If you don't try to stealth in darkness, folks can still tell basically where you are, and they can attack you normally, but they're blinded, so they're taking a penalty. If you DO try to stealth in dim light, the observer can't rely on their vision very well, which is why dim light gives the observer disadvantage. Dim light doesn't help the person stealthing, it inhibits the person detecting. But if they succeed, then they can see you normally - you're not stealthed, so they can attack you no problem. If you succeed, they're not aware of where you are at all. If you try to stealth in darkness (or while invisible), the observer can't rely on their vision at all, so they automatically fail. They can't possibly succeed on a Perception check to see you. You automatically hide from their vision. If you fail to stealth, they still can't see you, and still have problems attacking you. If you succeed on your stealth, they're not aware of where you are at all. So being invisible automatically lets you not be seen. What it doesn't do at all is prevent others from being aware of where you are, which has nothing to do with vision or being seen, and what Stealth represents, by RAW.Or, my personal takeaway: if you're invisible or in darkness, you're not stealthed. If you ARE stealthed when you can't be seen, the creature has to have some other way of detecting you that it's using, typically sound or scent.</blockquote>

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