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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 6685286" data-attributes="member: 2067">That's what I'd rule, and what I think is intended by the rules. Stealth isn't your ability to remain unseen, it's your ability to remain undetected. Two separate tracks. Bingo. Again, this is what I think is intended by the RAW. I think it's fine to discount invisibility as a hiding tool - magic should be useful, but not auto-success. Invis falls into that camp in this ruling: you can stand in the middle of a brightly lit room and stealth, but by the same token, you still have to stealth, so if you're a Wizard with 12 Dex, you might want to consider using that on the rogue instead. Where the bit of DM judgement comes is when you &quot;stop hiding.&quot; A DM running with RAW is well within their rights to call for you to make a stealth check *every time you move*, even if you're invisible, because your footsteps/air movement/etc. all give someone a chance to notice you. This can result in a lot of rolls when scouting. Which would be a severe limitation on it - you only get so many rolls before you fail, and every bit of motion you do is a new piece from the Jenga tower. It allows you to make Stealth checks. If you weren't impossible to see, you couldn't make Stealth checks. People automatically fail any check they make to see you.Right. It goes fromThey Can See You (you can't hide) &lt; They Can't See You Well (you can hide, they get Disadvantage to detect you visually) &lt; They Can't See You At All (you can hide, they automatically fail to detect you visually). Where some of the weirdness comes in is that &quot;failing to detect you visually&quot; is not the same as &quot;you are hidden from them.&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 6685286, member: 2067"] That's what I'd rule, and what I think is intended by the rules. Stealth isn't your ability to remain [I]unseen[/I], it's your ability to remain [I]undetected[/I]. Two separate tracks. Bingo. Again, this is what I think is intended by the RAW. I think it's fine to discount invisibility as a hiding tool - magic should be useful, but not auto-success. Invis falls into that camp in this ruling: you can stand in the middle of a brightly lit room and stealth, but by the same token, [B]you still have to stealth[/B], so if you're a Wizard with 12 Dex, you might want to consider using that on the rogue instead. Where the bit of DM judgement comes is when you "stop hiding." A DM running with RAW is well within their rights to call for you to make a stealth check *every time you move*, even if you're invisible, because your footsteps/air movement/etc. all give someone a chance to notice you. This can result in a lot of rolls when scouting. Which would be a severe limitation on it - you only get so many rolls before you fail, and every bit of motion you do is a new piece from the Jenga tower. It allows you to make Stealth checks. If you weren't impossible to see, you couldn't make Stealth checks. People automatically fail any check they make to see you. Right. It goes from They Can See You (you can't hide) < They Can't See You Well (you can hide, they get Disadvantage to detect you visually) < They Can't See You At All (you can hide, they automatically fail to detect you visually). Where some of the weirdness comes in is that "failing to detect you visually" [B]is not the same as[/B] "you are hidden from them." [/QUOTE]

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