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<blockquote data-quote="Greenfield" data-source="post: 6018808" data-attributes="member: 6669384">I'll have to take a look at that.Most systems have &quot;falling damage&quot; but not collision damage.&nbsp; That is, hitting the ground at 60 ft. per second (360 ft movement in D&amp;D) is covered, but running into a wall at the same speed isn't.I recall various attempts to do things like place a Portable Hole on a barn door, then haul said barn door up into the sky so you could empty the hole onto an enemy.From what you say, you'd need to be very high up to do any real damage, and the range increment for an improvised hurled weapon is such that hitting anything from that height is all but impossible.Back to the OP:&nbsp; There are always problems with absolute rules like Mage Hand not being able to attack.&nbsp; We've seen people here say things like, &quot;It's not attacking, it's just pouring acid on the person.&quot;&nbsp; They seem to equate, &quot;The target is so easy that I wouldn't bother calling for an attack roll&quot; with &quot;not an attack&quot;.You want to use the cantrip to dump poison in someone's drink, go for it.&nbsp; You want to dump in on their head, forget about it.&nbsp; You can't.&nbsp; It's one of those hard rules that just says &quot;no&quot;.There are similar &quot;unstoppable attacks&quot; that people try to come up with.&nbsp; Throwing a Wall of Force so the diving dragon hits it edgewise is a classic.&nbsp; People think that since it's a Force effect, it's like a light sabre and will slice and dice the dragon.&nbsp; As far as I know, however, there's nothing in the rules that says how thick the Wall of Force actually is.And, as noted, there aren't any actual collision rules, only falling rules.&nbsp; Running into a wall while flying is a situation they never covered, or even hinted at.Note:&nbsp; In the real world, a three foot fall will kill an elephant.&nbsp; In D&amp;D? Not a bruise or a hair out of place.It's just the way things work when you need to keep your rules playable.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Greenfield, post: 6018808, member: 6669384"] I'll have to take a look at that. Most systems have "falling damage" but not collision damage. That is, hitting the ground at 60 ft. per second (360 ft movement in D&D) is covered, but running into a wall at the same speed isn't. I recall various attempts to do things like place a Portable Hole on a barn door, then haul said barn door up into the sky so you could empty the hole onto an enemy. From what you say, you'd need to be very high up to do any real damage, and the range increment for an improvised hurled weapon is such that hitting anything from that height is all but impossible. Back to the OP: There are always problems with absolute rules like [I]Mage Hand[/I] not being able to attack. We've seen people here say things like, "It's not attacking, it's just pouring acid on the person." They seem to equate, "The target is so easy that I wouldn't bother calling for an attack roll" with "not an attack". You want to use the cantrip to dump poison in someone's drink, go for it. You want to dump in on their head, forget about it. You can't. It's one of those hard rules that just says "no". There are similar "unstoppable attacks" that people try to come up with. Throwing a [I]Wall of Force [/I]so the diving dragon hits it edgewise is a classic. People think that since it's a Force effect, it's like a light sabre and will slice and dice the dragon. As far as I know, however, there's nothing in the rules that says how thick the [I]Wall of Force[/I] actually is. And, as noted, there aren't any actual collision rules, only falling rules. Running into a wall while flying is a situation they never covered, or even hinted at. Note: In the real world, a three foot fall will kill an elephant. In D&D? Not a bruise or a hair out of place. It's just the way things work when you need to keep your rules playable. [/QUOTE]

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