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<blockquote data-quote="Ibrandul" data-source="post: 8741638" data-attributes="member: 6871736">I do know that. I'm describing a situation where the ability check DC is (say) 25, but the PC can't get up to a 25 result with a nat 20 + mods, because their mods are +4 or less.I think everyone agrees that in this situation, if the DM calls for this ability check then under 2014 RAW it would fail no matter the roll, whereas under 1D&amp;D it would succeed on a nat 20.What some have argued is that, under 2014 RAW, such a check is prohibited in the first place: the DM must first determine whether a 20 would succeed after mods are added, and if the answer is &quot;No,&quot; then the check must not be called for.My position is: no, 2014 RAW say nothing to prohibit the DM from calling for an ability check that would fail on a nat 20 + mods, if the DM determines that succeeding at the proposed task is possible in general.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ibrandul, post: 8741638, member: 6871736"] I do know that. I'm describing a situation where the ability check DC is (say) 25, but the PC can't get up to a 25 result with a nat 20 + mods, because their mods are +4 or less. I think everyone agrees that in this situation, [I]if the DM calls for this ability check[/I] then under 2014 RAW it would fail no matter the roll, whereas under 1D&D it would succeed on a nat 20. What some have argued is that, under 2014 RAW, such a check is prohibited in the first place: the DM must first determine whether a 20 [I]would succeed[/I] after mods are added, and if the answer is "No," then the check [I]must not be called for[/I]. My position is: no, 2014 RAW say nothing to prohibit the DM from calling for an ability check that would fail on a nat 20 + mods, if the DM determines that succeeding at the proposed task is [I]possible in general[/I]. [/QUOTE]

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