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Message: <blockquote data-quote="wlmartin" data-source="post: 5655745" data-attributes="member: 6679380">I do understand this however I can either do one of the following1 : Combine it with an Action Point to get my OoE on the target2 : Combine it with a shift so that I can move to the other side of my Target.To those that worry the Avenger is not the best damage output out of the strikers, I know this fullwell currently playing a Barbarian with Executioners Axe, his damage is OFF THE HOOK! however it gets a bit boring to just drop monsters every 5 minutes. I like optimization as much as the next man but I am in the game to have fun not play the "How many monsters can you beat in 5 minutes" game.One of the most annoying things in the game for me is not hitting. I would come up with a supreme tactical move where I do a double move then use an action point to unleash my 3[W] Encounter Power before "poof" I roll a 3.I then just shrink back into my chair, line up my power cards (flipping the ones I have just expended) and tell the DM my move is done.... I would trade all of the damage dice a Barbarian gets to actually hit something.Against an average foe, one that with modifiers you can defeat say on a roll of 10 + modifiers, an Avenger using OoE over a Barbarian gets to hit on average 25% more often. I have not done the maths on that but I am fairly sure  that the extra damage a Barbarian can do is reduced heavily by misses and if compared toe to toe against an Avenger that hits 25% more often, the Avenger may improve against him... and if he doesn't he would definitely hold his own.The powers I have will be combined with feat, utility and encounter powers that give me either a) Good Movement b) Ability to refocus my enmity.So in a situation where I have 2 foes in front of me (Points North and North East on my compass) and 1 foe behind me (Point south east on my compass) with my OoE on the guy to the north.In such an instance I could use Refocus Enmity on the guy to my south and then shift to the space to my south (his west) and hit him free of surrounding mobsIn another there be my OoE surrounding me with 2 other mobs, I refocus my enmity to someone that is further away from the group (perhaps a slinger or ranger on the far outskirts of the room), use Distracting Flare to become invisible and then move my speed and unleash hell on the OoE... one I can continue to beat on since his friends will take some time to move back over to me.The other option still is to sacrifice damage output and go for a Reach Weapon (where I am sure there are cool feats to do with Reach Weapons I ignore as I don't usually use them) and where all the surrounding mobs are at 1 reach positions, I simply shift back a bit and poke my OoE from a distance... the thought of that seems quite appealing.There is an interesting tactic with Censure of Retribution that I will take some getting used to. My DM will get used to me using Retribution Powers (specificaly encounter ones) that translate into "If there are enemies around me, they are going to be damaged" and he will choose to either a) Allow me to reap the rewards of these powers or b) Back off me a littleIf it is a) The loss in using my OoE so much because I will be surrounded more often is annoying but the extra damage I will do to surrounding foes could make me feel better about that b) Although I get to use my OoE more, I have Encounter Powers which aside from doing the [W] damage they do, are pretty useless since the DM wont put as many mobs near me.It is an interesting quandry to be sure.I also like the in game idea that my character will either be feared (the mobs will back away from him) or double teamed but considering this guy is pointing his finger and shouting that his god brings divine vengance to you, and you and you and... you! then it is foreseable that like the Wizard, he will be targeted before others.I am going to RP this character as much as I can and although Power of Skill sounds handy, Ioun is really the only deity you can use it with and I don't like him for an Avenger... Who is he going to kill? Those that hunt librarians? Book burners?Instead I chose Ilmater as whilst Ilmater has only one real enemy (Lovitar) his sphere of influence is in aiding and healing the sick, tortured and enslaved... Having an Avenger that brings divine vengance upon those that bring pain and suffering to innocents seems a lot more realistic in an Adventurer.Other Avengers, if RPed would need to be more like Hunters searching out Orcs, Drow (Corellon), Giants, Trolls (Moradin) etc rather than just joining an Adventure Group in the hopes of perhaps finding some enemies to bring vengance to... Whereas Ilmater fits perfectly because there is suffering in almost every D&D quest / adventure and having the purpose to hunt that down seems a lot more appropriate for an Avenger and I am surprised more have not chosen to play Ilmater Avengers before.I am still stuck on what Race to choose.If I minmax I go for Deva but Devas are a bit too delicate for me. Also the idea is that my character grew up in slavery and was free by Ilmater followers, was taught their ways and inducted into the Order of the Pained Hand and trained as an Avenger... since Devas just "poof" into existence as adults, that storyline is screwed up for me.Githerzai seems like a good option for this build but I am not 100% sure in using them, I will if I have to but am looking for another option.Shardmind again have the 2 attributes I need (Wis & Int) but they again dont feel right in an Avenger.Does anyone have a good suggestion for an Avenger Race that isnt 100% minmaxed (ie has 1 of the 2 attributes I need to save me on point buying) I am not playing this character like he is within the top 5 builds for DPS or accuracy, losing a modifier + in Int / Wis is not the end of the world for me as I will be RPing this character more, however I don't want to hobble him too much as I still need him to be feasible.</blockquote>

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