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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Reffy" data-source="post: 5979259" data-attributes="member: 6676309">I see that more people agree it would not be a surprise round.Let me give you more details.The characters play Chaotic Neutral...which is why they act like that.When they play good characters, they don't do such things, though it seems they are always chaotic. No discipline at all. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />But hey, it's about having fun. I don't mind as a DM.The characters are in a dungeon. They don't know how they got here. They've lost all their equipment and need to survive as a team, or perish.(Based on Legend of Grimrock)Because the dungeon is brutal, they always walk with their weapons equipped. I think I would have done the same thing.Also, they are not used to unequip their weapons. But I will remind them the next time we play.The eventually met a doppleganger, who took the identity of one of the players. They were standing next to the doppleganger, with their weapons equipped. The players acted smart, they asked questions to the doppleganger and the player who's identity has been copied. However, a doppleganger can read minds (unless the subject makes a will save).The questions didn't help, and suddenly, one of the players attacked the doppleganger. The other players agreed during table talk at that point, and claimed they could also attack, before the doppleganger could do even a thing.Anyway, it turns out that they killed the wrong guy. The doppleganger was with them the entire time. They killed their own guy. (Serves them right in my opinion <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />)ConclusionSo they didn't plan ahead, and just table talk as in game agreements. I will tell them that this is not how it works.I remember when we played 4.0. And my character (not npc) had a discussion with another PC. The guy got angry about something and attacked me.The DM gave him an insane surprise round. He moved and then used a daily and an encounter power (action point). Then we had to roll initiative. He rolled higher, so he could attack again. It's funny, but also sad. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />I will keep the bluff check in order to surprise someone in mind. But for now, just rolling initiative will suffice.</blockquote>

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