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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elf Witch" data-source="post: 5709576" data-attributes="member: 9037">First of all I never said that fudging to kill a character is right. I would never do that as a DM. Well here is a  clarification I once as part of the story killed the PCs in a massive earthquake that destroyed their city. But they woke up on their god's plane of existence and were recruited for a war between the god and his enemy. They didn't lose a level or XP or really suffer any penalty.I don't save a PC for story reasons (unless it is to stop a TPK) or to railroad a plot. But as I have said before I have fudged when I made a mistake or when I can see that having their PC killed is not going to be fun for the player like the one who had just had it raised. My players have told me they don't want to play in a game where a TPK can happen. I have played in a lot of games with random encounters where the DM just rolls them on a table. I lost my first PC to a random encounter ten minutes after I started my first game.  The DM rolled on a table and the first level party got strafed by a red dragon. I still don't think that was a fun encounter and is why I would never use a table. If it is part of the plot then it is not a random encounter. I never said that letting the dice fall where they may is always a hack and slash campaign but I have mainly encountered it with games that are more beer and pretzels and less story. A TPK in my experience can end a story campaign very fast especially if there is no way to raise any of the party. So since I want a heavy story campaign I try and avoid TPKs. But I am sure there are people who play story games without screens and people who play hack  and slash with screens. One thing I never assume is that my way is the only way to play.Some players make bad decisions and get there PCs killed but I have seen players make all the right decisions and still have their PCs die because of the dice. The player I mentioned who had her character die and then be raised to die again if I hadn't fudged didn't do anything strategically bad. The first time she got hit by a fireball and failed her save and took massive damage followed by being critted by a raging barbarian. And then no one could get to her to stabilize her and  she could not make the roll to stabilize herself. The second time she almost died was because of failing a save for  for being paralyzed by undead then being hit by spell. When I rolled the damage for the spell I realized it would kill her outright and I could see how unhappy she was so I did less damage and brought her to 1 hit point instead.I am not sure what you are trying to say with the serious roleplayer line. Yes my group are what you would call serious role players I guess because we like story continuity and things to happen for a reason as part of a plot.  When a new PC comes in we want more than you look trustworthy join us.That does not mean we expect to have plot immunity and never die or have bad things happen to our characters.I run an organic world and my players know that there are things that are to powerful for them. So they know that there are things that sometimes they need to run from. That is not the same things as an encounter that you build for them to actually fight and then find out that it is to much of a challenge for them. When I DM I use verbal clues to help them know this. I also answer questions on knowledge rolls  so they have some idea about what they are facing. I made huge mistake in a published encounter I ran once that had a lot of undead in it and the party didn't have a cleric. I should have adjusted it for that. And by the time I realized what was going on they couldn't run. So I fudged some things on the fly I brought down how many hit points the undead had and I saved the one PC.</blockquote>

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