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<blockquote data-quote="Man in the Funny Hat" data-source="post: 4072424" data-attributes="member: 32740">As I noted in another post, if the DM wants to win - he wins.&nbsp; If he wants to kill a PC for any reason - they die.&nbsp; Players will understandably get upset if they find their PC in a situation where the DM has &quot;engineered&quot; there to be NO CHANCE of escape, rescue, or other success.&nbsp; It doesn't have to be true that the DM has in fact done so.&nbsp; Players will get upset merely if it APPEARS so.For players to continue to draw enjoyment out of the game, even when the game is supposed to be harsh, they will need to feel that their characters are given reasonable chances for success.&nbsp; That includes for captured characters to escape or be rescued.&nbsp; What one player considers reasonable will almost certainly be a bit different from the next - and ALL will be somewhat different from what the DM feels is reasonable.&nbsp; Open, frequent communication with players is the best way to prevent it from ever being a problem.&nbsp; And no, simply telling them, &quot;Be careful - your PC's REALLY might die in THIS dungeon,&quot; is not enough if a player FEELS like he's gotten the shaft (even if he's wrong).Nobody is saying captured PC's must never be killed.&nbsp; We're saying, &quot;Just because you CAN, doesn't mean you SHOULD.&quot;&nbsp; The fact that the player is upset rather indicates that the player and DM are NOT on the same page here.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Man in the Funny Hat, post: 4072424, member: 32740"] As I noted in another post, if the DM wants to win - he wins. If he wants to kill a PC for any reason - they die. Players will understandably get upset if they find their PC in a situation where the DM has "engineered" there to be NO CHANCE of escape, rescue, or other success. It doesn't have to be true that the DM has in fact done so. Players will get upset merely if it APPEARS so. For players to continue to draw enjoyment out of the game, even when the game is supposed to be harsh, they will need to feel that their characters are given reasonable chances for success. That includes for captured characters to escape or be rescued. What one player considers reasonable will almost certainly be a bit different from the next - and ALL will be somewhat different from what the DM feels is reasonable. Open, frequent communication with players is the best way to prevent it from ever being a problem. And no, simply telling them, "Be careful - your PC's REALLY might die in THIS dungeon," is not enough if a player FEELS like he's gotten the shaft (even if he's wrong). Nobody is saying captured PC's must [I]never[/I] be killed. We're saying, "Just because you CAN, doesn't mean you SHOULD." The fact that the player is upset rather indicates that the player and DM are NOT on the same page here. [/QUOTE]

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