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Message: <blockquote data-quote="wally" data-source="post: 1935787" data-attributes="member: 3578">As to charming drunken louts, it really depends.  There are people out there who can drink a lot and be charming, but you were making it sound like he had these urges that he kept giving in to.  That sounds to me like an internal conflict.  Those that are out partying and having a good time getting drunk aren't the ones I am talking about, and it isn't the way you made this guy sound.No, ability scores don't dictate player choices, but it is a numbers way to represent the issue. If the character is having urges that he doesn't want to give in to because he wants to follow the 'proper' way, then the player can easily say that he gives in, but that isn't playing the character.  If the character has high will saves and a high wis/cha, then the character can easily resist the temptations.  I was saying that if you apply the flaws to the numbers, then you have a reason for the characters actions.  If the character has the ability to resist, but the player has the character give in to the urges, then it shows that the character isn't really losing the conflict within.  He is just being a drunken lout because he wants to, not because he has inner desires that are overwhelming him.  In that case, he is falling from grace through his own controlled choice, and I would see a god looking at him with less favor.  If you know what I mean.   <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> Also, if you think that the powers that a paladin gets are not that worthwhile, then why are you so adamant about keeping them?</blockquote>

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