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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Crazy Jerome" data-source="post: 5833303" data-attributes="member: 54877">I'm happy to see the acknowledgement of multiple reasons, but the original remark, which I have seen in that form several times recently by multiple people, does not.  In it, you are conflating at least three different things, and thus implying a casual connection that you are in no way illustrating: 1. Market share - which we know only from anecdote, but even granted for sake of argument, is the sum of a whole host of things.  No doubt there are particular features of 4E that have contributed, but we don't know the exact ratio.  For example, we don't know how much 4E is hurt by the fact that it happened so "soon" after 3E/3.5 were done, compared to the decade of lying fallow that 3E dropped into.   2. Economic conditions totally separate from the quality or appreciation of the games.  3E was launched in the middle of a booming recovery (best possible moment for a luxury product).  4E was launched in one of the worst global recessions since gaming starting (the worst possible moment). 3. Things in 4E that have led directly to less appeal and/or restricted what people wanted to do with it.  (And to stay on topic here, only those things that are related to or in the pursuit of balance.) In short, if you have an argument that something in 4E related to balance has restricted its appeal, you should be able to make that argument outside of the first two issues (or indeed, even particular flaws of 4E not in any way related to balance--such as the sometimes goofy names).  There are good debating reasons for doing so, but I'm not primarily interested in those.  I'm interested in solutions.  The only way we get to solutions is to talk about the particulars of the actual problems.  Saying, "this has been tried and some people aren't buying it," is a worthless remark.  Everything in D&D, by definition, has been tried, and I guarantee that someone didn't like it.</blockquote>

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