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<blockquote data-quote="Urbannen" data-source="post: 1055094" data-attributes="member: 7643">Psion:&nbsp; I think point buy is fair because all players have the same options to start with.&nbsp; I understand that some classes aren't as good unless the character has several high stats, namely paladins, rangers, and monks.&nbsp; But just because you roll high stats doesn't mean that you are going to choose one of these options.&nbsp; Rolling low means that you can't choose one of these options.&nbsp; And if you roll for dice, the DM has to say &quot;I want to see your rolls.&quot;&nbsp; I know what goes on when an player rolls alone.&nbsp; &quot;Well, that was just a test run.&quot;&nbsp; &quot;Well, if I take 1 from this 14 and add 1 to that 17, that's still fair.&quot;&nbsp; When I have entered groups that rolled without the DM looking, my honestly rolled stats have always been lower than the others'.&nbsp; In one group I played two campaigns with, both my characters had a negative stat modifier, and they were the only ones that did.&nbsp; If there is no concrete way to determine stats, then there is no basis for comparison.&nbsp; &quot;Your cleric/fighter only has a 9 Int? general looks of disdain from the group in which no character has lower than a 12&quot;&nbsp; Back on topic, if you want to both roll and reduce the spread of characters' abilities, then you have to do it mathematically.&nbsp; How about 3d4+6, rolled 6 times, arrange to taste?&nbsp; Stats range from 9 - 18, with the average stat being 13.5.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Urbannen, post: 1055094, member: 7643"] Psion: I think point buy is fair because all players have the same options to start with. I understand that some classes aren't as good unless the character has several high stats, namely paladins, rangers, and monks. But just because you roll high stats doesn't mean that you are going to choose one of these options. Rolling low means that you can't choose one of these options. And if you roll for dice, the DM has to say "I want to see your rolls." I know what goes on when an player rolls alone. "Well, that was just a test run." "Well, if I take 1 from this 14 and add 1 to that 17, that's still fair." When I have entered groups that rolled without the DM looking, my honestly rolled stats have always been lower than the others'. In one group I played two campaigns with, both my characters had a negative stat modifier, and they were the only ones that did. If there is no concrete way to determine stats, then there is no basis for comparison. "Your cleric/fighter only has a 9 Int? [i]general looks of disdain from the group in which no character has lower than a 12[/i]" Back on topic, if you want to both roll and reduce the spread of characters' abilities, then you have to do it mathematically. How about 3d4+6, rolled 6 times, arrange to taste? Stats range from 9 - 18, with the average stat being 13.5. [/QUOTE]

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