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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dross" data-source="post: 3634547" data-attributes="member: 33802">I think the player needs to have a focus on what he wants to do in combat. A bard has a support role, they are not a strait up fighter or sneak attacking rogue or a damaging spellcaster. It is just not their nature to do HP damage themselves.The main options are probably:pepper spellcasters, leaders etc with missle fire. Or move up to them and deny them chances to cast spells.Use aid another, flanking (with fighting defensively), or reach weapons to aid party memebers.Get spells like Tasha's Hideous Laughter, Glitterdust etc that can take out opponents that fail their save, and boost the DC of those saves where possible. Another good PrC to me is the Dragonsong Lyrist (Draconomicon), can boost STR by 4, allow flight for a short time and a couple of other things, looses out on spells a bit though.Ruined, I'm assuming that you are the DM soo here is something for you (just note that I haven't played AoW): sonic locks (need music, singing, tune to open), negating sonic abilites (harpies etc) can allow the bard to shine. Bardic Knowledge for useful info always helps (if the player doesn't already use this). Have something that only the bard can do (and hope they do it  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ).I currently have a bard character in a game, and I think the trick is a slight shift in approach: Any boosting of your party that leads to a kill is partially your kill. A save v spell that the PC would not make is almost the same as having the caster waste a spell. Preventing party memebers from getting hurt keeps them alive and able to hurt others (more partial kills for the bard). I've been able to make a major damage dealing foe helpless with laughter so others can bash them without getting hurt. Boosted STR to help damage foes in large battles. Greased entryways to hinder people getting through doors. Kept PC's standing via healing to lay the hurt on our foes. These are the things a bard does. and he can even sing for his supper.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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