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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Kraydak" data-source="post: 4561958" data-attributes="member: 12306">Early paragon tier, longsword vs hammer, +5 con modifier.Say the hammer battle-rager needs a 13 to hit, while sword-boy w/weapon talent and an additional point of Str needs a 10.Over 20 attack rolls, the hammer guy gets +(12*5 from misses)+(8*2 from battlerager)=76 extra damage from sources the sword guy doesn't get (+1 str cancels hammer's higher base damage).Over those same 20 attack rolls, the sword-guy gets 3 bonus hits.So if the sword-guy's hits do more than 26 damage, he pulls ahead (+1 str has already been counted, so needs to be discounted here).  At +10 to damage (+5 str, +3 weapon, +2 feat), he needs 16 on the dice.  The breakeven point is between 3 and 4 W.  Good luck on that, and you aren't getting the defensive benefits.But wait, it gets better for hammer-boy: his numbers get better as the opponent's AC gets worse.  He pulls through in a pinch, while the sword guy does better in cases where victory is already assured.  Further, hammer-guy gets noticeably more benefit out of the various auto-damage stances.The better ability to land the debuffs with swords is nice, but don't pretend the battle-rager is giving up much offense.  He is of course, especially compared to a weapon-talent+hammer rhythm build, but it isn't debilitating.  In not-that-special circumstances, he'll actually do more damage (those pesky stances, again, where the +2 to damage applies but the +1 to hit is irrelevant)!(N.B. I do not own MP.  I could easily be getting details, like +2 damage on the stances, wrong)</blockquote>

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