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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mengu" data-source="post: 4852117" data-attributes="member: 65726">It's one feat. That's all you need. If you're a dwarf you get stoneblood, otherwise you get improved vigor. There is nothing else feat-wise that should affect this build differently than a sword and board defender. These are true. But it also means your leader can almost completely ignore you for healing, and focus on others who will need it more. There are a lot of ripple effects that happen from the inclusion of a battlerager. DM feels they need to up the challenge of the encounters since the battleragers are so durable, this becomes tough on the strikers, and tough on the leader. A power doesn't need to be invigorating to give temp hit points with the updated version of battlerager vigor. When you hit with comeback strike, not only do you get to spend a healing surge, you also gain temporary hit points equal to your con modifier. Myth. The difference is +1. Weapon Talent. That's it. The only other arguable difference is when each builds might pick up expertise. But if they wanted, they could both pick it up at first level. So even that doesn't create a gap. There is nothing forcing a battlerager to start with lower strength, or use a +2 proficiency weapon. You do NOT need to start with 20 con to make an effective battlerager tank. 16 con (before or after racial bonus) is plenty sufficient.</blockquote>