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Message: <blockquote data-quote="doctorbadwolf" data-source="post: 7545405" data-attributes="member: 6704184">Cap: on mobile so quoting is a pain. I don’t think that most BM pets need to be able to tank multiple big enemies, even at level 20, but that does bring up an interesting facet to this. The BM needs options at subclass levels, so you can have a tougher, deadlier, or more utilitarian, pet. A bear tank pet should be able to tank a couple fire giants without too much worry (at my table, most non tank PCs would be in danger in that situation, but I’ll skip that), but a wolf should be on par with a rogue, not a heavy armor melee character, in terms of staying in melee. But we don’t need to run the numbers on anything but attack and damage, because we have known values for AC and HP. I’d give all BM pets proficiency on all saves, and Evasion, at ~ lvl 11. As for damage, again there are many ways to go. The simplest is to use the known numbers for scaling, and simply give them a Pack Attack trait that adds d8s to their damage once per turn, and let them have a turn, make 1 Attack regardless of if they normally have multiattack, run those numbers and adjust from there. We don’t need to hash out the exact numbers unless you want to literally build a new BM subclass in this thread. I’d say that how much damage it can do depends on how often it will die, and whether or not you can bring it back as part of a long rest, magically. If it’s PHB style “get a new one”, and the math means it will die often, then it needs to be pretty damn strong, and put the ranger somewhere around Hunter+15% to 20% in rounds where the ranger and beast both hit. Maybe higher. Which is probably a bad thing. If we can expect to have for most fights, with good scaling HP and AC, and a Xgold ritual as part of long rest to get the same pet back, then it can bring the ranger up to just over the Hunter’s average damage per round. Maybe 5%, 10% at most. I think you’re the only person I’ve seen argue that it’s a problem if the beast doesn’t do impressive damage on its own, but I’m willing to be proven wrong. Either way, I think it’s fine if we look at average damage for the Hunter at each tier, and assume that the BM should be slightly above that. I’d also give players the choice between the flurry of attacks it gets at 11, or an extra single target damage boost, or a taunt/mark ability to bring enemies to it, or even some kind of support ability, where anyone attack a creature engaged with the pet or marked by it or whatever gets a damage boost. There is a lot we can do, other than pure DPR. I just don’t buy the idea that the pet needs to match a t-rex in damage just because it’s got a lot of HP. But, if that is a must, let it do so via scaling to stay at the same percentage of added damage and defense compared to the base class, and new ranger spells.</blockquote>

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