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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 7916688" data-attributes="member: 6785785">So mechanics are only needed when health or functionality of character are at stake? Are there never other stakes that come up in a game? Stakes where the difference between success and failure is as meaningful as those of combat? I don't think this explanation you've offered does a lot to justify mechanics for combat but none for social interaction. I mean, &quot;if there's a risk of failure, roll the dice&quot; is a pretty fundamental approach to RPGs.Well, except in an instance where someone is actively asking for ways to go further with this, such as the OP and his follow up comments.It is very possible. It's also fully at the players whim to do so. That doesn't seem all that meaningful, since the player could just as easily decide for his character not to get angry. And no one can question or chalenge that because &quot;It's my character so I decide!!!!&quot;If there was some character trait that could com into play and be a potential trigger that could result in an undesirable action.....that by definition is more character driven play.Those are all widely accepted because magic. What about when a person charms someone in a totally mundane way? People can do that in real life.....it happens all the time. Real people are not as in control of themselves as a Player is of his PC. So if the players decided to, by fiat, have this kind of altercation break out, that's fine, but if a game had mechanics that allowed for this to happen, that's not fine? That's odd.And I know that you ascribe to the idea that &quot;no character is special&quot; and I think the parity you're promoting here among PCs and NPCs relates to that, so I can understand your reasoning here.However, don't you think that &quot;character-driven&quot; play as described in the OP and throughout the thread must by definition place an importance on character? If this is &quot;Jack's Story&quot; then how is Jack not more important than most of the characters that appear in the story? I don't think that you can claim to promote character driven play while simultaneously dismissing the importance of character.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 7916688, member: 6785785"] So mechanics are only needed when health or functionality of character are at stake? Are there never other stakes that come up in a game? Stakes where the difference between success and failure is as meaningful as those of combat? I don't think this explanation you've offered does a lot to justify mechanics for combat but none for social interaction. I mean, "if there's a risk of failure, roll the dice" is a pretty fundamental approach to RPGs. Well, except in an instance where someone is actively asking for ways to go further with this, such as the OP and his follow up comments. It is very possible. It's also fully at the players whim to do so. That doesn't seem all that meaningful, since the player could just as easily decide for his character not to get angry. And no one can question or chalenge that because "It's my character so I decide!!!!" If there was some character trait that could com into play and be a potential trigger that could result in an undesirable action.....that by definition is more character driven play. Those are all widely accepted because magic. What about when a person charms someone in a totally mundane way? People can do that in real life.....it happens all the time. Real people are not as in control of themselves as a Player is of his PC. So if the players decided to, by fiat, have this kind of altercation break out, that's fine, but if a game had mechanics that allowed for this to happen, that's not fine? That's odd. And I know that you ascribe to the idea that "no character is special" and I think the parity you're promoting here among PCs and NPCs relates to that, so I can understand your reasoning here. However, don't you think that "character-driven" play as described in the OP and throughout the thread must by definition place an importance on character? If this is "Jack's Story" then how is Jack not more important than most of the characters that appear in the story? I don't think that you can claim to promote character driven play while simultaneously dismissing the importance of character. [/QUOTE]

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