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<blockquote data-quote="chaochou" data-source="post: 7917927" data-attributes="member: 99817">The only way to talk about character-driven play is to seperate it clearly from GM-driven play, and that means highlighting where play is GM driven. The fact that a lot GM-driven play doesn't want to admit what it is, isn't my problem.I consider it extremely helpful to bring such illusionism blinking and resentful into the cold hard light. Why can't players who are playing their own side-game of outcome-free emoting throughout the GMs plot can be discussed in those terms? To present such as a demonstration of a 'dramatic character arc' when no-one even noticed it was happening, is frankly laughable. To bring it into a thread about character-driven play is even more so.Illusionism is about lying to people about how much agency the players have. Player agency is a valued currency - one playstyle features it and another doesn't but lies about it. Are you able to talk about that? Is it allowed (by you)? Apparently not.But maybe you have an example of character-driven play to share? Or recommended systems for the OP? If not, why are you here?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="chaochou, post: 7917927, member: 99817"] The only way to talk about character-driven play is to seperate it clearly from GM-driven play, and that means highlighting where play is GM driven. The fact that a lot GM-driven play doesn't want to admit what it is, isn't my problem. I consider it extremely helpful to bring such illusionism blinking and resentful into the cold hard light. Why can't players who are playing their own side-game of outcome-free emoting throughout the GMs plot can be discussed in those terms? To present such as a demonstration of a 'dramatic character arc' when no-one even noticed it was happening, is frankly laughable. To bring it into a thread about character-driven play is even more so. Illusionism is about lying to people about how much agency the players have. Player agency is a valued currency - one playstyle features it and another doesn't but lies about it. Are you able to talk about that? Is it allowed (by you)? Apparently not. But maybe you have an example of character-driven play to share? Or recommended systems for the OP? If not, why are you here? [/QUOTE]

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