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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Ben Riggs' "What the Heck Happened with 4th Edition?" seminar at Gen Con 2023
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<blockquote data-quote="James Gasik" data-source="post: 9201823" data-attributes="member: 6877472"><p>It's certainly how it worked in 4e, where being Invisible gave you +5 AC. The way I see it, when you have stuff like the original 3e Shield spell handed out something ridiculous like +7 AC, you kind of painted yourself into a corner with regards to defensive buffs. If you have Blur as a 2nd level spell, and it's less effective than a 1st level defensive spell, that's a problem, and piling on more AC on top of that might be problematic, especially with how they wanted melee weapon warriors to work, with multiple attacks of descending success rates.</p><p></p><p>Rather than scaling things down (like how the 3.5 Shield was equal to a Tower Shield), they elected to have a second line of defense separate from AC. Which really affected play a big deal- enemies with miss chances were obnoxious, and so you had to find ways to combat them, while trying to find your own miss chance abilities, and I don't think anyone really liked the mechanic. It slowed down play, was often a feel bad moment, could turn off abilities like Sneak Attack- just a mess, really.</p><p></p><p>While I understand being invested in 3.5 (I know I was) when 4e came out, 3.5 was plagued by a lot of rules that seemed to exist largely to make the game less fun, and 4e took steps to eliminate a lot of cruft.</p><p></p><p>Of course, it had it's own odd rules, but I still felt it was an improvement.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="James Gasik, post: 9201823, member: 6877472"] It's certainly how it worked in 4e, where being Invisible gave you +5 AC. The way I see it, when you have stuff like the original 3e Shield spell handed out something ridiculous like +7 AC, you kind of painted yourself into a corner with regards to defensive buffs. If you have Blur as a 2nd level spell, and it's less effective than a 1st level defensive spell, that's a problem, and piling on more AC on top of that might be problematic, especially with how they wanted melee weapon warriors to work, with multiple attacks of descending success rates. Rather than scaling things down (like how the 3.5 Shield was equal to a Tower Shield), they elected to have a second line of defense separate from AC. Which really affected play a big deal- enemies with miss chances were obnoxious, and so you had to find ways to combat them, while trying to find your own miss chance abilities, and I don't think anyone really liked the mechanic. It slowed down play, was often a feel bad moment, could turn off abilities like Sneak Attack- just a mess, really. While I understand being invested in 3.5 (I know I was) when 4e came out, 3.5 was plagued by a lot of rules that seemed to exist largely to make the game less fun, and 4e took steps to eliminate a lot of cruft. Of course, it had it's own odd rules, but I still felt it was an improvement. [/QUOTE]
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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Ben Riggs' "What the Heck Happened with 4th Edition?" seminar at Gen Con 2023
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