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D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Ben Riggs' "What the Heck Happened with 4th Edition?" seminar at Gen Con 2023
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<blockquote data-quote="Aldarc" data-source="post: 9216697" data-attributes="member: 5142"><p>I think that you are having the words "Cure Wounds" do a lot of heavy lifting if you believe that the game is going out of its way to say that the mechanical operation means that only meat is restored as part of the spell. Are we told what kind of wounds they are? Are they spiritual wounds? Magical wounds? Psychological wounds? The spell is silent. I guess that I put more value in the fact that the game says that the spell is restoring HP, and we know that HP represents more than just meat. Otherwise we lose sight of the forest for the trees. </p><p></p><p></p><p>This feels more like an attempt to throw back the terms "double-standard" and "special pleading" back. I don't think that this is special pleading any more to say that light is both a particle and a wave. Is the fact that light exists as multiple things a form of special pleading or a double-standard? The fact that tension exists between these things does not mean that it's a form of special pleading or a double-standard. Sometimes it just means that life is vague, complicated, or not so cut-and-dried simple. Sometimes a game mechanic represents multiple things and not just one thing. </p><p></p><p>We could likewise look at all the things that the Wisdom attribute represents: willpower, intution, awareness, etc. There will be contradictions contained therein and yet, mechanics will interact with Wisdom regardless of the tension of these elements that may be created in our understanding of the fiction. I may not like Wisdom as an attribute, but I don't think it's apt to say it's special pleading or a double-standard that Wisdom represents a variety of disparate things. I likewise don't think the fact that HP represents multiple things means that a double-standard or special pleading is involved. </p><p></p><p></p><p>Damage on a miss is simply an acknowledgment that the character has injured or weared-down someone, but that their target has managed to minimize their injuries. <img class="smilie smilie--emoji" alt="🤷♂️" src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f937-2642.png" title="Man shrugging :man_shrugging:" data-shortname=":man_shrugging:" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" /> </p><p></p><p></p><p>He has me on ignore, so his neatness of his explanations are totally lost on me. However, as other people in this thread seem to have remained unconvinced that they are different animals, it seems that regardless of the neatness of his explanation, it failed in convincing others. <img class="smilie smilie--emoji" alt="🤷♂️" src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f937-2642.png" title="Man shrugging :man_shrugging:" data-shortname=":man_shrugging:" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Aldarc, post: 9216697, member: 5142"] I think that you are having the words "Cure Wounds" do a lot of heavy lifting if you believe that the game is going out of its way to say that the mechanical operation means that only meat is restored as part of the spell. Are we told what kind of wounds they are? Are they spiritual wounds? Magical wounds? Psychological wounds? The spell is silent. I guess that I put more value in the fact that the game says that the spell is restoring HP, and we know that HP represents more than just meat. Otherwise we lose sight of the forest for the trees. This feels more like an attempt to throw back the terms "double-standard" and "special pleading" back. I don't think that this is special pleading any more to say that light is both a particle and a wave. Is the fact that light exists as multiple things a form of special pleading or a double-standard? The fact that tension exists between these things does not mean that it's a form of special pleading or a double-standard. Sometimes it just means that life is vague, complicated, or not so cut-and-dried simple. Sometimes a game mechanic represents multiple things and not just one thing. We could likewise look at all the things that the Wisdom attribute represents: willpower, intution, awareness, etc. There will be contradictions contained therein and yet, mechanics will interact with Wisdom regardless of the tension of these elements that may be created in our understanding of the fiction. I may not like Wisdom as an attribute, but I don't think it's apt to say it's special pleading or a double-standard that Wisdom represents a variety of disparate things. I likewise don't think the fact that HP represents multiple things means that a double-standard or special pleading is involved. Damage on a miss is simply an acknowledgment that the character has injured or weared-down someone, but that their target has managed to minimize their injuries. 🤷♂️ He has me on ignore, so his neatness of his explanations are totally lost on me. However, as other people in this thread seem to have remained unconvinced that they are different animals, it seems that regardless of the neatness of his explanation, it failed in convincing others. 🤷♂️ [/QUOTE]
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Ben Riggs' "What the Heck Happened with 4th Edition?" seminar at Gen Con 2023
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