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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 3242509" data-attributes="member: 4937">Fair enough I suppose. No, it learned what ash was.  The best you could say is that in knowing ash, fire learned it's future.  But, in the terms of an elemental, even that is not clear.  There is no particular reason that the elemental plane of fire shouldn't burn forever, and it certainly does it without fuel or air.  Fire, as an elemental, doesn't need anything but itself to exist.  (Fire in our world is not elemental.  This fact creates difficulty in understanding elemental fire.  You'd probably never say, 'Sodium learned what it was when it first encountered potasium.')A cubic centimeter of steel buried inside three square miles of steel doesn't know alot of things.  But it does know what steel is.  In fact, that's pretty much all it knows.  Explaining what steel was to it would be easy.  It would answer, "Oh, you mean like all this stuff."  But explaining to it what wasn't steel would be tough.  You'd try to explain what water was, and you'd have to say, "It's like steel but softer."  The responce would be, "What's this 'soft' you speak of?"   That would be hard to explain to something that had never known anything but steel.Which doesn't mean that a droplet of sentient water forever in communion with the ocean doesn't know what water is.  Looking back, I see that I took your attempt to be helpful as an insulting presumption that I lacked creativity or intelligence and hense needed your help.  When the elemental becomes mixed with something else, it ceases to be elemental.  Elemental things are defined by thier purity.  Elemental oxygen is pure oxygen.   Elemental sodium is pure sodium.   When an elemental thing confronts something else, it must remain apart or else cease to be what it is.   Fire cannot confront water without both of them becoming something different.You don't read many fairy tales do you?Because of enthropy, there is no such thing as an additive parasite in our experience.  But on the positive elemental plane, they don't experience enthropy.  Hense, a symbiote creature from the positive elemental plane doesn't exactly fit within our existing vocabulary.Now that is an argument for another day.  It would be rather difficult to argue the reverse - that the negative energy plane is not associated with evil in any fashion.You mean the ones from the negative energy plane?So spake a nuetrally aligned deity.  But, it isn't necessarily the goal of good aligned dieties to see a cycle of nature continue.  They don't aim for balance or stasis.  Rather, they hope at some point to see the cycle broken and eternal goodness reign.   In parallel, the evil deities also want to see the cycle broken, but broken in a negative way and eternal evil reign. Are you completely positive that the negative and positive energy planes have nothing to do with this?I'm sure you didn't.  Do you think that this means that I'm more obtuse than anyone else you've spoken too?</blockquote>

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