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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6231877" data-attributes="member: 42582">I know a lot of people played AD&D without miniatures. I was one of them. But the rules aren't based around abstract positioning. Movements rates are specified in feet/yards per unit of time, not in terms of mechanical augmentation to effects (which is how they would be expressed in MHRP, or HeroWars/Quest, or (I assume) FATE).Ranges, likewise, are specified in feet/yards. And locations are typically mapped out with non-abstract positioning. (I'm thinking of the classic white-on-blue dungeon maps inside the TSR modules.)I think this non-abstract use of distance and time is - for better or words - a big part of the D&D play experience. To get rid of it would be a big deal. But while we have it, it puts limitations on how abstract resolution can become, and also puts constraints on how the action economy can work (eg the action economy must have a "movement" phase or element).4e does get rid of this part of D&D resolution as far as skill challenges are concerned, but that causes its own headaches - for instance, in effect you have two sets of climbing rules, the abstract ones that are applicable in skill challenges (and work like Maelstrom Storytelling or HeroWars/Quest) and the non-abstract ones that are applicable in combat, and work just like climbing has always done in D&D. The same is true of jumping and swimming.</blockquote>