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Bladesinger/arcane trickster
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<blockquote data-quote="Adb0782" data-source="post: 8196223" data-attributes="member: 6945705"><p>but even without the 1 and 1/5 str...its still more than what a melee rogue can do (sorry, i didnt consider ranged with shapeshifter) and if it gets the racial feats of half orc or EA + rackless attack as an half elf, with brutal critical it can deal tons of damage. Anyway 5e I think is archery friendly and mostly of what you can do with a sword you can do it better with a bow (archery fighters, better if battlemaster, are awesome in 5e), but i would not understimate the dpr of a barbarian zealot, with the right race and the right feats i dont think is below the rogue, except sneak attack enter every round or to get a missunderstand about the surprised rules if we talk about assassin.</p><p></p><p>thats funny. I can try to do it but seem in my party have no archers.</p><p></p><p>Yea but the real problem of any of this build is that its impossible to set with stat buy system, except maybe bring con at 10 that can be a real, huge problem...2 use for short rest can be accetable, but with 10 con i seriusly dont know if it can work.</p><p>About whispers bard: yea it probably work much better with 5 lv dip, and in my opinion is better than dip rogue if get good stat, even if the rogue give probably more damage boost, but slots progression (that mean counterspell always at the higher lv possible and SB same) balance the thing, plus bard spells that its something i cant get anywhere else, boost to counterspell till can counter near everithing, and even without crit at hight lv he deal 10d8 + 3d6 +10 + 1d8 that its 75 (or 65 without smite as he probably wont smite without a crit) from lv 13 (at same lv my HW 11/Rogue 2 with shapeshifter and crossbow expert make something like 3d10 +1d6 + 2d8 +45 if there are at least 3 enemies, that mean a total to 75, or 2d10 +1d6 +2d8 +30 without the 3rd attack that its around 55, so i can say the damage is kinda same at this lv but HW is just half caster and this ranger make our sorceradin always mad bcs he deal (few) more dpr than her, but well, she is anyway playing a more tanky shield and board sorceradin, so no +10 and no big weapons, or she could easly overcome my HW), and before dont seem to be so bad too. It problably would be 6 BS/5 WB/ 7 BS/2 WB. It can suffer on LV 7 till 11 bcs he ll still have 2 use for long rest, but counterspell and bard spells can help to dont make regret the choice.</p><p>5 lv sword bard i also was thinking about that but it give me more defense and this guy already is almost untouchble, what he need is pure damage more than defense for be worth to delay simulacrum (and other earlier spells), otherwise better stay BS i suppose and probably better stay BS even with the damage boost.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Adb0782, post: 8196223, member: 6945705"] but even without the 1 and 1/5 str...its still more than what a melee rogue can do (sorry, i didnt consider ranged with shapeshifter) and if it gets the racial feats of half orc or EA + rackless attack as an half elf, with brutal critical it can deal tons of damage. Anyway 5e I think is archery friendly and mostly of what you can do with a sword you can do it better with a bow (archery fighters, better if battlemaster, are awesome in 5e), but i would not understimate the dpr of a barbarian zealot, with the right race and the right feats i dont think is below the rogue, except sneak attack enter every round or to get a missunderstand about the surprised rules if we talk about assassin. thats funny. I can try to do it but seem in my party have no archers. Yea but the real problem of any of this build is that its impossible to set with stat buy system, except maybe bring con at 10 that can be a real, huge problem...2 use for short rest can be accetable, but with 10 con i seriusly dont know if it can work. About whispers bard: yea it probably work much better with 5 lv dip, and in my opinion is better than dip rogue if get good stat, even if the rogue give probably more damage boost, but slots progression (that mean counterspell always at the higher lv possible and SB same) balance the thing, plus bard spells that its something i cant get anywhere else, boost to counterspell till can counter near everithing, and even without crit at hight lv he deal 10d8 + 3d6 +10 + 1d8 that its 75 (or 65 without smite as he probably wont smite without a crit) from lv 13 (at same lv my HW 11/Rogue 2 with shapeshifter and crossbow expert make something like 3d10 +1d6 + 2d8 +45 if there are at least 3 enemies, that mean a total to 75, or 2d10 +1d6 +2d8 +30 without the 3rd attack that its around 55, so i can say the damage is kinda same at this lv but HW is just half caster and this ranger make our sorceradin always mad bcs he deal (few) more dpr than her, but well, she is anyway playing a more tanky shield and board sorceradin, so no +10 and no big weapons, or she could easly overcome my HW), and before dont seem to be so bad too. It problably would be 6 BS/5 WB/ 7 BS/2 WB. It can suffer on LV 7 till 11 bcs he ll still have 2 use for long rest, but counterspell and bard spells can help to dont make regret the choice. 5 lv sword bard i also was thinking about that but it give me more defense and this guy already is almost untouchble, what he need is pure damage more than defense for be worth to delay simulacrum (and other earlier spells), otherwise better stay BS i suppose and probably better stay BS even with the damage boost. [/QUOTE]
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