Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Booming Blade seems a bit powerful
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Arial Black" data-source="post: 7170050" data-attributes="member: 6799649"><p>Fair questions.</p><p></p><p>The answer is easy though. First, the general rule is, "Each spell description in chapter 11 begins with a block of information, including the spell’s name, level, school of magic, casting time, range, components, and duration. <strong>The rest of a spell entry describes the spell’s effect</strong>".</p><p></p><p>Second, 'specific beats general'. In this case, if the wording shows that a particular clause <em>cannot</em> be part of the 'spell effect', then it isn't; this is the 'specific' that beats the 'general' of the whole thing being the 'spell effect'.</p><p></p><p>But it has to say so. It isn't about us picking and choosing what bits we want to define as the 'spell effect' <em>this</em> time and which bits we don't. It has to be stated in such a way that it literally cannot be the 'spell effect', without the spell being nonsense. If there are two ways to read a rule and one way means it cannot function then we <em>must</em> read it the other way.</p><p></p><p>For <em>booming blade/green-flame blade</em>, these spells say, "As part of the action used to cast this spell, you must make a melee attack with a weapon against one creature within the spell's range, otherwise the spell fails". The <em>cause</em> of a spell (an action which is required for the spell to come into being) literally <strong>cannot</strong> be the <em>effect</em> a the (successfully cast) spell. Cause <strong>must</strong> come before effect. Therefore, this clause literally <strong>cannot</strong> be part of the 'spell effect', and this makes it a specific exception to the general rule that the whole description <strong>is</strong> the 'spell effect'.</p><p></p><p>It's not the only thing like that. Targeting information and such-like are also things that enable the spell to be cast, rather than being the 'spell effect'. Saving throw information isn't directly a 'spell effect', but the result of that save (what happens if you save or fail) <strong>is</strong> part of the 'spell effect'.</p><p></p><p>For <em>booming blade</em>, the 'spell effect' is that the target is sheathed in a sonic bubble. That bubble has certain qualities regarding what happens if you willing move through the bubble, and ALL of those qualities ARE the 'spell effect', including what happens in the world to cause the bubble to burst (trigger) and the consequence of the bubble bursting (thunder damage, spell ends early).</p><p></p><p>Since the sonic bubble (and its qualities) ARE the 'spell effect', then you cannot have two of them on you at the same time re: Combining Magical Effects. Since you only have one bubble even if two spells are on you, there is no trigger for the second bubble to burst because there <em>is</em> no second bubble to burst!</p><p></p><p>However, when the first spell ends (for whatever reason) then there is no longer anything preventing the second spell from applying, and so as soon as the first bubble goes away then the second spell forms a new bubble, and the qualities of that new bubble become relevant.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Arial Black, post: 7170050, member: 6799649"] Fair questions. The answer is easy though. First, the general rule is, "Each spell description in chapter 11 begins with a block of information, including the spell’s name, level, school of magic, casting time, range, components, and duration. [b]The rest of a spell entry describes the spell’s effect[/b]". Second, 'specific beats general'. In this case, if the wording shows that a particular clause [i]cannot[/i] be part of the 'spell effect', then it isn't; this is the 'specific' that beats the 'general' of the whole thing being the 'spell effect'. But it has to say so. It isn't about us picking and choosing what bits we want to define as the 'spell effect' [i]this[/i] time and which bits we don't. It has to be stated in such a way that it literally cannot be the 'spell effect', without the spell being nonsense. If there are two ways to read a rule and one way means it cannot function then we [i]must[/i] read it the other way. For [i]booming blade/green-flame blade[/i], these spells say, "As part of the action used to cast this spell, you must make a melee attack with a weapon against one creature within the spell's range, otherwise the spell fails". The [i]cause[/i] of a spell (an action which is required for the spell to come into being) literally [b]cannot[/b] be the [i]effect[/i] a the (successfully cast) spell. Cause [b]must[/b] come before effect. Therefore, this clause literally [b]cannot[/b] be part of the 'spell effect', and this makes it a specific exception to the general rule that the whole description [b]is[/b] the 'spell effect'. It's not the only thing like that. Targeting information and such-like are also things that enable the spell to be cast, rather than being the 'spell effect'. Saving throw information isn't directly a 'spell effect', but the result of that save (what happens if you save or fail) [b]is[/b] part of the 'spell effect'. For [i]booming blade[/i], the 'spell effect' is that the target is sheathed in a sonic bubble. That bubble has certain qualities regarding what happens if you willing move through the bubble, and ALL of those qualities ARE the 'spell effect', including what happens in the world to cause the bubble to burst (trigger) and the consequence of the bubble bursting (thunder damage, spell ends early). Since the sonic bubble (and its qualities) ARE the 'spell effect', then you cannot have two of them on you at the same time re: Combining Magical Effects. Since you only have one bubble even if two spells are on you, there is no trigger for the second bubble to burst because there [i]is[/i] no second bubble to burst! However, when the first spell ends (for whatever reason) then there is no longer anything preventing the second spell from applying, and so as soon as the first bubble goes away then the second spell forms a new bubble, and the qualities of that new bubble become relevant. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Booming Blade seems a bit powerful
Top