Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 371286" data-attributes="member: 4937">RobNJ: Huh? I don't see how what you said follows from the quote and I feel like you are misreading me (my fault or yours I don't know yet).  I don't know where you are coming from with that but I'll try to cover a few broad bases.1) I have no problem with mature people covering serious topics in a serious fashion.  This includes evil.2) I don't like the sound of whatever 'blandly heroic' is, but don't believe that my games fall into that category.  Indeed, when people raise objections about how standard D&D doesn't deal with mature themes (like for example Good vs. Good or truly heinous villany), I wish they would append the remark with IMC, because I've never noticed that problem in my campaign or in any that I've ever played in.3) I don't have a problem with evil PC's, though I'll qualify that by saying that I've seen certain players be really annoying about it (generally those that think evil is k3wwwwwl).  But that is the same as saying I have a problem with annoying people and immature play.  In fact, I've run several all evil campaigns focused solely on demi-humans.  In fact, I find doing so adds depth to the good guys so that they begin to realize that IMC, even the poor thugs that work for the villian have some depth.I long remember an early session when the players discovered that which they knew if they thought about it - that Hobgoblins had wives and children too, and that mostly they had the same basic desires as the townsfolk.  Albiet some of these desires led them to murder and pillage the townsfolk.4) I consider my campaigns RP first, gaming second.  I much prefer that players in my campaign do not know the rules (at first).  This leads them to role play instead of roll play.  That said, I don't consider there to be all that sharp of divide between the game first and the role play first crowd.   Exactly what did I say that you found so disperging of those that enjoy tactics, puzzle solving, and combat?Henry: To be brief (which is hard for me), the problem was not that evil provided a way to quick power (of some sorts) - which is fine - but that that power came at no price.  If RPing a monster is to serve any really deep purpose at all, it seemed to me that it served the purpose of reflecting upon not just that which you gain, but that which you give up.  Unfortunately, under the system, you really didn't have to give up anything, even humanity.  Willpower typically was so high that you didn't have to give up a portion of your free will either.  Things only got worse when they introduced systems that completely replaced humanity and had all of its benifits and none of its restrictions, and if you really wanted to ignore that you were a monster there were advantages available that cured all your ills.One of the most annoying elements to me was Glocunda (sic), which basically gave you a path back to humanity without stopping being a monster.  Have your cake and eat it too.  Why would you want anything else?  Struggling to regain your (full) humanity?  Just how many players did you see trying to do that?  And give up all there nifty keen super powers?  I think not.</blockquote>

Verification