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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ketjak" data-source="post: 24600" data-attributes="member: 1083">Breaking down the CR/EL numbers(This post appears on the EN World and Monte Cook's message boards. My apologies if it smells like spiced ham.)Folks,The party I DM and I are having trouble evaluating the party's effective level and establishing other related numbers. Our party contains2 3rd level characters (an elven ranger and a gnome wizard)3 2nd level characters (a nezumi ranger, a vanara wiz/OA shaman, and a halfling fighter/rogue)1 1st level character (a half-orc cleric)1. What is the party's effective level? The question really is: how does one determine the party's effective level for parties containing other than four characters? (The formula on DMG 101 says it's 13/6, or 2; I consider it to be 13/4, or 3.)2. If the party were an encounter for a different party, what is the EL of the party? (I calculate approximately 7 - that is, the party would represent a drain of 20% resources for all and seriously threaten one of four 7th-level characters.)3. What EL is appropriate for this party to face (use ~20% of the party's resources and seriously threaten one member of the party)? (I believe an EL of 3 is appropriate.)Here's some legwork I did to help us out:ASSUMPTIONThe Challenge Rating system uses four characters as the basis for determining EL, the party's effective level, and experience awards.DEFINITIONSI've tried to isolate the terms used by the system. There is no glossary inthe DMG that provides a convenient definition for each term. The PlayersHandbook was written before the DMG was complete, so I'll avoid that unlessI can't define the terms using the DMG.  ++ CR (Challenge Rating) - a numeric representation of the amount oftrouble a single monster (or trap) is expected to give a group of fouradventurers."A Challenge Rating is a measure of how easy or difficult a monster or trapis to overcome." (DMG pg 165)"A monster's Challenge Rating tells you the level of the party for whichthat monster is a good challenge. A monster of CR 5 is an appropriatechallenge for a group of four 5th-level characters. If the characters arehigher level than the monster, they get fewer XP because the monster shouldbe easy to defeat. Likewise, if the party level (the average of thecharacter levels of every member of the party) is lower than a monster'sChallenge Rating, the PCs get a greater reward." (DMG pg 100, lastparagraph)"Parties with five or more members can often take on monsters with higherCRs, and parties of three or fewer are challenged by monsters with lowerCRs. Nevertheless, XP awards depend on the group's average level." (DMG pg101)  ++ EL (Encounter Level) - a numeric representation of the amount oftrouble a group of monsters or traps or monsters and traps is expected togive a group of four adventurers."Obviously, if one monster is a given Challenge Rating, more than onemonster is a greater challenge than that. You can use Table 4-1: EncounterNumbers to determine the Encounter Level of a group of monsters, as well asto determine how many monsters equate to a given Encounter Level (useful inbalancing an encounter with a PC party)." (DMG pg 101)"To balance an encounter to a party, determine the party's effective level(the average of all their character levels).[1] You may want the party'slevel to match the level of the encounter, so find that number[2] in the"Encounter Level" column. Then look across that line to find the CR of thecreature type that you want to use in that encounter. Once you have foundit, look to the top of that column to find the number of creaturesthat makes a balanced encounter for the party." (DMG pg 101)NOTES on encounter level:[1] I am of the opinion this is not written as clearly as they intended. Forexample, ten 2nd-level characters have an party effective level of 2, asdoes a party composed of four 2nd-level characters. Using this system aswritten both parties should be challenged by the same encounter: one CR 2 or3 monster or trap. This must be accounted for somehow. My method is to totalthe character levels in the party and divide by four to arrive at anapproximate party effective level. It breaks down at large spreads, which iswhy it's never better than an estimate.[2] I have inferred "that number" refers to the party's effective level.  ++ Effective[3] Party Level (EPL) - a numeric representation of theparty's approximate power level based on character levels."A monster's challenge rating tells you the level of the party for whichthat monster is a good challenge. A monster of CR 5 is an appropriatechallenge for a group of four 5th-level characters. If the characters arehigher level than the monster, they get fewer XP because the monster shouldbe easy to defeat. Likewise, if the party level (the average of thecharacter levels of every member of the party) is lower than a monster'sChallenge Rating, the PCs get a greater reward." (DMG pg 100, lastparagraph)NOTES on effective party level:[3] I have frequently erred and called this the "average" party level.Technically and according to the rules, the two are the same. I do notbelieve this was intended as illustrated above; taking it to the absurdshows how this does not apply AND how my system breaks down: 100 2nd-levelcharacters has an effective party level of 2 - by the books. Using my roughsystem generates a result of "50," meaning a CR 50 monster would use about20% of the (100-character) 2nd level party's resources. That's absurd, as aCR 50 creature would likely be untouchable by the individual second levelcharacters and would likely kill several each round.</blockquote>

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