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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FormerlyHemlock" data-source="post: 6866153" data-attributes="member: 6787650">[Preface: If you're not sure why you'd want to plant traps in your dungeon, you need to read <a href="http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.com/2014/01/on-reader-mail-find-traps-skill.html" target="_blank">this post</a>: "The purpose of a trap is to make decisions meaningful. If there is no risk from just walking around, opening chests, or exploring rooms, then those activities become flat and dull. If the only threat is monsters, then you've removed uncertainty from the game making it flatter and less interesting. Traps should make the play of the game more interesting."]I've been thinking lately about traps in dungeons and how on the one hand they are more fun if players interact with them directly through roleplaying (as opposed to Perception or Investigation checks), and on the other hand, players should still reap some benefit if they chose to invest mechanically in Investigation/etc., because that's part of agency too.Let's say I've got an interesting trap planned. (Or at least, one that I think is interesting.)Let's say the trap is that the floor is weak and rotten, and that approaching the trestle tables in the center of the room will result in floor collapsing like a pit trap into the room below (which is inhabited by several Grey Oozes). This trap can be avoided by player skill, of course, just like any other trap--e.g. testing the floor with a 10' pole before venturing onto it, examining the floorboards to find out what's causing the decaying stench, etc. But how do we make it rewarding for the Rogue who invested in Perception Expertise and the Observant feat? Do we just say, "Oh, your passive Investigation is 19, so you know the floor will collapse if you walk on it?" That seems likely to cheapen the experience.So here's the solution I'm considering: set the DCs really high (but somewhat random), and don't let one skill give away all the answers. After all, there's no law of nature that says it should be easy to detect rotten flooring just be looking at it. Keeping the DCs randomized prevents the challenge from becoming too binary.In this specific case, let's say there is no way normally to detect the rot visually before you actually step on the section which is rotten enough to give way under the weight of an adult human, but not only can you smell the rot easily (DC 2d10+5 Perception (smell) check determined in advance to notice that the smell of decay is stronger in the center of the room; DC 2d10 + 10 check determined in advance to realize that it smells like an old lumberyard after the rain) but it's possible to outright deduce that the floor here is probably weak (DC 15 + 3d6) just because it's so old and wet.Players who outright ask about some feature of the environment ("can I tell where the smell is coming from?") automatically get the correct answer; players whose passive Perception or passive Investigation beat the requisite DC get that information volunteered to them by the DM.TL;DR if you're worried about gamist mechanics sucking all the joy out of dungeon traps, you can just set the DCs realistically high, high enough to represent "a normal person would not figure this out automatically just by looking around even if they rolled a natural 20; only a trained individual might recognize this situation as something he's seen before". Mid-twenties is probably a good range.</blockquote>

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