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General Tabletop Discussion
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition (A5E)
Build A Stronghold
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<blockquote data-quote="Kinematics" data-source="post: 8408064" data-attributes="member: 6932123"><p>Yeah, kinda figured that was the case, but since you didn't provide the whole thing, that's the best we can do.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So, buying by the square foot is more minutia than we really need. My inclination would be to divorce the price from the explicit size. Get rid of the square feet entirely, and base grades more on conceptual units.</p><p></p><p>I tried several approaches. Unfortunately, while mostly possible, there are some parts that don't really work, and even the parts that do are more complicated than they would be with a base unit method.</p><p></p><p>So my final conclusion was to simply change the concrete size unit (square feet) into an abstract unit (eg: Stronghold Investment Points), and rewrite the Size table as a more generalized idea about the stronghold constructs.</p><p></p><table style='width: 100%'><tr><th>Grade</th><th>Investment</th><th>Description</th><th>Examples</th></tr><tr><td>1</td><td>50–100</td><td>About the size of a single room.</td><td>A hut, a personal library, a private workshop, a shop wagon, a small training room, a garden, a sacred tree, a bunker, or a campsite.</td></tr><tr><td>2</td><td>101–1000</td><td>A single small building with multiple rooms, or similar total space.</td><td>An apartment, a house, a shop, a tavern, a laboratory, a menagerie, a small temple, a sacred grove, or a minor guildhouse.</td></tr><tr><td>3</td><td>1001–10,000</td><td>Multiple small buildings, a large building, or a fair bit of land.</td><td>A small farm, a manor, a stockade, or a bandit encampment</td></tr><tr><td>4</td><td>10,001–25,000</td><td>A substantially large building, likely with surrounding grounds.</td><td>A mansion, a mage's tower, an emporium, a school, a keep, or a large guildhouse.</td></tr><tr><td>5</td><td>25,001–50,000</td><td>Multiple large buildings or expansive grounds.</td><td>A cathedral, a castle, a university, a large farm, or an army camp.</td></tr><tr><td>6</td><td>50,001–100,000</td><td>A very large building and grounds, or substantial lands.</td><td>A minor palace, a fortress, a basilica, a ranch, a forbidden forest, or a pyramid.</td></tr><tr><td>7</td><td>100,001–250,000</td><td>An imposing building (or collection of buildings) and lands, or large quantities of land.</td><td>A palace, a citadel, a plantation, or a hidden village.</td></tr><tr><td>8</td><td>250,001+</td><td>Massive buildings and lands.</td><td>A grand palace or great pyramid.</td></tr></table><p></p><p>Notes for examples:</p><p>A shop wagon could be something like a traveling tinker's wagon, or a ramen stand or other food wagon.</p><p>A hidden village (more likely a hidden elf village than a ninja village) would be a high-tier encampment.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Investment points would translate directly to gold just like square feet do (along with the multipliers from environment and quality). The only table change needed would be for calculating staff, which just becomes staff per investment instead of staff per square feet (which also feels less problematic). For sub-strongholds, they just need to be noted as not using more than half the investment used on the main stronghold. And this eliminates the ambiguous "external grounds" thing entirely.</p><p></p><p>Of course "Investment Points" is just a placeholder term. If you still want to keep it tied to size in some way, you could also call it "Footprint", without referring to explicit measurement units. That would allow it to give a general sense of size without needing to imply a rigid linear relationship. Still, I think "Investment" works better.</p><p></p><p>Overall, this is a fairly trivial change, and not the complete rebuilding I was planning on. However the change from square feet to "investment points" gets rid of a lot of uncomfortable tensions in the original write-up.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kinematics, post: 8408064, member: 6932123"] Yeah, kinda figured that was the case, but since you didn't provide the whole thing, that's the best we can do. So, buying by the square foot is more minutia than we really need. My inclination would be to divorce the price from the explicit size. Get rid of the square feet entirely, and base grades more on conceptual units. I tried several approaches. Unfortunately, while mostly possible, there are some parts that don't really work, and even the parts that do are more complicated than they would be with a base unit method. So my final conclusion was to simply change the concrete size unit (square feet) into an abstract unit (eg: Stronghold Investment Points), and rewrite the Size table as a more generalized idea about the stronghold constructs. [TABLE] [TR] [TH]Grade[/TH] [TH]Investment[/TH] [TH]Description[/TH] [TH]Examples[/TH] [/TR] [TR] [TD]1[/TD] [TD]50–100[/TD] [TD]About the size of a single room.[/TD] [TD]A hut, a personal library, a private workshop, a shop wagon, a small training room, a garden, a sacred tree, a bunker, or a campsite.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]2[/TD] [TD]101–1000[/TD] [TD]A single small building with multiple rooms, or similar total space.[/TD] [TD]An apartment, a house, a shop, a tavern, a laboratory, a menagerie, a small temple, a sacred grove, or a minor guildhouse.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]3[/TD] [TD]1001–10,000[/TD] [TD]Multiple small buildings, a large building, or a fair bit of land.[/TD] [TD]A small farm, a manor, a stockade, or a bandit encampment[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]4[/TD] [TD]10,001–25,000[/TD] [TD]A substantially large building, likely with surrounding grounds.[/TD] [TD]A mansion, a mage's tower, an emporium, a school, a keep, or a large guildhouse.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]5[/TD] [TD]25,001–50,000[/TD] [TD]Multiple large buildings or expansive grounds.[/TD] [TD]A cathedral, a castle, a university, a large farm, or an army camp.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]6[/TD] [TD]50,001–100,000[/TD] [TD]A very large building and grounds, or substantial lands.[/TD] [TD]A minor palace, a fortress, a basilica, a ranch, a forbidden forest, or a pyramid.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]7[/TD] [TD]100,001–250,000[/TD] [TD]An imposing building (or collection of buildings) and lands, or large quantities of land.[/TD] [TD]A palace, a citadel, a plantation, or a hidden village.[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]8[/TD] [TD]250,001+[/TD] [TD]Massive buildings and lands.[/TD] [TD]A grand palace or great pyramid.[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] Notes for examples: A shop wagon could be something like a traveling tinker's wagon, or a ramen stand or other food wagon. A hidden village (more likely a hidden elf village than a ninja village) would be a high-tier encampment. Investment points would translate directly to gold just like square feet do (along with the multipliers from environment and quality). The only table change needed would be for calculating staff, which just becomes staff per investment instead of staff per square feet (which also feels less problematic). For sub-strongholds, they just need to be noted as not using more than half the investment used on the main stronghold. And this eliminates the ambiguous "external grounds" thing entirely. Of course "Investment Points" is just a placeholder term. If you still want to keep it tied to size in some way, you could also call it "Footprint", without referring to explicit measurement units. That would allow it to give a general sense of size without needing to imply a rigid linear relationship. Still, I think "Investment" works better. Overall, this is a fairly trivial change, and not the complete rebuilding I was planning on. However the change from square feet to "investment points" gets rid of a lot of uncomfortable tensions in the original write-up. [/QUOTE]
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