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Message: <blockquote data-quote="jgsugden" data-source="post: 7192044" data-attributes="member: 2629">I am surprised by the love in this thread for the rogue as I have not seen the class work well beyond the lower levels.  Out of combat, pretty much all of the tricks that the rogue has get surpassed by magic.  People just throw a spell at a problem and the locked, trapped, etc... issue disappears.   It may start at 6th level or take until 11th before it starts to happen, but it happens.In combat, they are overshadowed by pretty much everyone.  An 11th level assassin may get off a nice starting assassination strike for 2d8 + 7 + 12d6 for about 60 damage - maybe even two assassinations for 120 if they are sneaky about it.  However, the party vengeance paladin can deal 150 in that alpha strike round with smiting, haste, great weaponmaster, etc...   In subsequent rounds when they're not going all out, the rogue is dealing 40 while the paladin is dealing 90.  I strongly feel that the class would be better balanced if all attacks were allowed to be sneak attacks rather than having the once per turn limit.  It would allow a hasted rogue, a two weapon rogue, etc... to be competitive in melee.  I admit to having not played a rogue in 5E for more than 1 session (the only class I have not significantly played), but I have seen a lot in my parties and the higher level rogues just don't stay competitive and end up feeling outclassed by their peers - every single time.  In my opinion, this class, more than the ranger, needed an overhaul.</blockquote>

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