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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jeffrie" data-source="post: 5662838" data-attributes="member: 93465">It screams Lyrist to me also, but as much as i wriggle, i can't get 9th level spells without nearly cheating. R2/ CC3 / W1/ MT4/ FL10 with speak druid from a regional feat called  Bardic College, but whoops, no bardic knowledge, which only comes from  bard. So16th level caster and 8th level spells. not bad really. But it  needs Heighten Spell cheese to qualify like this.Something i'm really starting to consider just today though, is settling for 8th level spells and going all Spontaneous Caster. ````    R2/ beguiler1 / favored soul1 / MT4 / bard1 / FL10   ````or sum'nThis gives lots of spells per day, and by going Martial Rogue the build  will be gish/skill in the early levels, lag a bit from 5-7 and again at  9, but begin to really kick with the spell/skill combo around 12th.   While it's true that this build never gets 9th level spells, it does  have spontaneous builds on both sides that pick from large list. The  amount of spells is staggering, and though it still sucks Versatile  Spellcaster almost tempts me.I have tons of Fochlucan Lyrist builds around, but i could never make  one work without either taking an alignment i just couldn't stand, or  going human, or just putting up with only 8th level spells.I just found Archivist, which might be what he meant earlier by  artificer. I love the ability to add any spell to my list, and am trying  now to find the perfect way to blend it with a spontaneous caster and  maybe MT and FL or some silliness.When i see the character (at low levels) in my mind, most folks don't  think of him as the most powerful in the group, or even really take him  seriously as a gun. But his Disquise is maxed and he has Invisible Spell  and Greater Invisibility and Power Attack and that 'metamagic music'  bard feat. Oh and all that hide from the world nondetection stuff. And  Still Spell and Silent, and Eschew, so he's always on the down low. D'ya think that beguiler/favored soul/lyrist thing can get all that? It looks like it has enough skills to make me happy.Or maybe i should keep the archivist/sorcerer/lyrist idea? larger spell  list for sure but less spells per day and not as many spontaneous.Either way, i can change the spell list as i go, or even retrain feats  to get what i need, so. . what about those? Got any ideas or options  that might sway me?I also have a Cloistered  DweomerKeeper with about 7 domains and a fair bit spontaneous that's kinda cool. . . . I also have an idea for a Cloistered Beguiler that takes at least 10  Beguiler for the Silent and Still, and then tack on some other metamagic  classes, though i hadn't looked at that yet. I can't see enough to  interest me.</blockquote>

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