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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Blue" data-source="post: 3604724" data-attributes="member: 20564">I think a concept where one gains some special abilities and have them balanced vs. the other players is good.  (Yes, that's very general.)  If those special abilities are based from race, class, what-have-you.I'm somewhat intrigued by the idea that some abilities depreciate and potentially even expire.  But if I was going to do it for races, I'd really want to do it for everything.For instance, at 3rd level (well, ECL 3 is probably better since we're talking LA), 2nd level spells are important.  At ECL 15, those 2nd level spells are worth a lot less.  If a character hasn't advanced them in the past 12 levels, does that mean they should get a break on them, even though they "paid" for them (by taking 3 levels of a casting class) at the time?  Well, they paid for them, and they were useful.  That seems like value given and value paid for.The other part of this is foundation - things to build off of.  Using your Centaur example, lets look at the LA part:I don't see all of those as "easy to make up".  Goign through them point for point:*  +3 Natural armor.  Any AC bonus that other PCs get, so can the Centaur.  So they will stay ahead.*  (skills and feats are from HD, everyone has those, nothing special offered)*  Darkvision - if a PC is wearing an item for darkvision, the same gold and item slot can give something else to the Centaur.  So they still have something the others do not.*  Speed - options for bonus speed also add to centaur.  In addition, there are a number of abilities and items that give flight equal to land speed, so they can parlay that land speed into even more of a bonus.*  Stat bonuses - same.  Give a human and a centaur gauntles of ogre power, and the human is +2 strength and the centaur is at +10.*  (Centaurs don't have reach)*  Large - this is half and half.  Some size increases will affect them, and large to huge is just as cool as medium to large.  Some, like enlarge person, won't because of their type.  But that's okay because the flip side is that spells like charm person won't either.  On the other hand, being large is definitely a downside at times.This only addresses the bonuses that cost LA - which is what you were talking about in terms of buyoff.  I see all of these as giving value.I didn't address racial HD.  For the most part, racial HD ranges from inferior to vastly inferior to PC classes.  Monsterous Humanoid is around the same as the "warrior" NPC, some (like animal) don't even compare that well, and some (like outsider) are almost good.  I think racial HD is an entire different point.  Because how many other things (like skill max ranks and saves) are tied to HD you can't just assign a negative LA or discount monster HD.  But that's a different thread.Cheers,=Blue(23)</blockquote>

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