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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mercurius" data-source="post: 6234201" data-attributes="member: 59082">Practically speaking I like [MENTION=22424]delericho[/MENTION]'s suggestion, with the addition that you could build incentive in by having little hints and lore in the write-up that impacts actual play.But to address the larger picture, I think [MENTION=177]Umbran[/MENTION] is right that there are a few issues that, while related, shouldn't be conflated. I'd like to speak briefly to two.First of all, in terms of "buy in" and what should or can be expected from players, I think its good to remember that most players - at least in my experience - just show up to be entertained. It is active entertainment, in that they are involved with the process, but they don't want "homework," and most don't even want to make characters or level up outside of game sessions. For folks like us that participate on online forums, we need to remember that we're a minority within the RPG community: we're the "few" that really love all aspects of the game beyond just the play session. We love world building, campaign design, adventure prep (usually!), collecting and reading RPG books, discussing RPGs and the industry, etc. Most players only, or at least mainly, just like to play.I'd suggest that, as a DM, you try to differentiate what goes into the session, the actual play experience, and what happens out of session - and don't expect players to do much of the latter. In the Player's Primer thread you mentioned, I came to the conclusion that two pages or so of text for a primer is acceptable, but as you said, anything more detailed or specific to an individual PC, should be handled on a "need to know" basis. This brings me to the second aspect. There are three main reasons or outcomes for world building (that I can think of): as a setting for gaming, to produce a commercial product, and for love of the creative process. I would suggest that whichever of those three applies to you, that the third - love of the act itself - should be primary. You don't need to share everything with your players, nor do they need to know what you know about the world. But if you love the process of world building and game design do it for its own sake, and then use it in your game and, if you want to go that route, publish it and try to make a few bucks. But with any creative work, the main incentive should always be for love of the act itself. If you clarify that within yourself, the issue of player buy-in is less pressing because what you create doesn't need to be shared or known within the game itself. As the DM you are creating a context, setting, and story for your players. The whole experience is co-created, but your role is primary in terms of both responsibility and outside time and work. DMs tend to be the folks that love RPGs more than the players do, and we can't expect them to love it as much as we do.As a teacher of high school students I've had the experience of being really excited about an idea and then sharing it with students and, when they don't share my same excitement, feeling somewhat disappointed (this also happens with my wife!). But I've learned to get over it, and while I want to share my ideas and excitement for them, I try not to be too invested in them others feeling the same, or even similarly. In teaching the main goal is to convey an idea or experience so that it lives within the student, that they make it their own - which may be different than it is for me or how I intended it to be. Similarly, with my players the main goal I have is for everyone to have a good time - including myself - to immerse us into a world that is living and evocative. As for the commercial question, I think the best way is to create something that you love and hope that others enjoy it enough to buy it. Trying to please others can lead to some financial success, but it is usually fleeting and ultimately unsatisfying, like getting a high paying job doing something you don't feel passionate about. Those first paychecks are nice, but in the end, what's the point? What really matters?</blockquote>

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