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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Swarmkeeper" data-source="post: 8425644" data-attributes="member: 6921763">It may not be helpful in all cases, but it is what the designers decided upon.Also, one could potentially argue the 80-20 rule here.  ~80% of game play occurs at first tier so... yeah those DC descriptors are spot on most of the time.  (someone, please correct me if you have an accurate account of data to refute my 80-20 claim.  The DnD Beyond character data are likely a reasonable approximation.  Perhaps more than half is a better estimate than 80%... but I digress).Further, while certain difficult things are easier for high level characters, the current paradigm of DC descriptors (...10=easy, 15=medium, 20=hard...) still work for that individual 15th level Fighter who dumped INT and is now asked to make an INT(Investigation) ability check.I appreciate the bolded reminder.  I'm here to learn, too.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Disagree.  An ability check DC is very much dependent upon the approach taken by the PC in the context of said obstacle.  Are you really going to say a locked door - which everyone in the party wishes to open - has the same DC for the rogue who is going to use their thieves tools vs the wizard casting knock vs the barbarian who is going to run up and ram it with her body weight vs the bard who is going to punch it (he mad b/c the barbarian didn't like his song of rest)? The approach very much plays into the DC here. Or, let's simplify the example. Is it the same DC for the barbarian who is deciding between two options: 1. run up and slam her body weight into the locked door OR 2. whack at the lock with her great club? It's not about the actor, though.  It's about the actor's approach and goal.  In the previous example, if the barbarian and bard were both to throw their body weight into the door individually, the DC would be the same - just the barbarian might be more likely to succeed based on their stats and abilities. Another example:  there is a 15x15 foot pit blocking the way in a wider-than-usual dungeon corridor.  Is the DM to assign a DC to the pit before finding out how the different PCs are going to approach this obstacle?  IMO, that is backwards.Note that the DMG pg 237-239 first instructs DMs to determine if the task proposed by the player is an auto-success or impossible for the PC.  Then it tells DMs to only call for a roll if there is a meaningful consequence of failure.  Only then, a full page later, does it get into setting DCs.Is the distinction clearer now?</blockquote>

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