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<blockquote data-quote="ValhallaGH" data-source="post: 5032771" data-attributes="member: 41187"><p>You're welcome.</p><p></p><p>Multi-class <em>should</em> happen. Among other things, it's the only way to expand your class skill list (and therefore the list of skills you can take Skill Training in).</p><p></p><p>The same thing that messes up low BAB characters: Defenses increase faster than their ability to hit those defenses (defenses increase +1 / level, Skills [UtF included] increase +1 / 2 levels, lesser BAB increases +3 / 4 levels or worse if you multi-class multiple 3/4 BAB classes).</p><p>At level 14, minimum defenses (before Class, Ability, and Equipment bonuses) are 24. Most defenses are around 30. Most Force Wizards will be on a +21 or so (slowing down but still awesome), while a Dex 12 Noble will be on a +11 to hit, and a Dex 16 Noble 6 / Scoundrel 3 / Ace Pilot 5 will be on a +12 to hit.</p><p></p><p>The way skills (especially UtF) work is that you are extremely front-loaded (+5 training, +5 focus, ~+3 ability = +13 at first level) but your progression is slow, eventually being matched or out-stripped by defenses (+16 level, +4 class bonus, +4 ability = 34 Defense <em>vs.</em> +18 UtF = +5 training, +5 Focus, +8 1/2 level, +5 ability). Always excepting the Education Destiny and it's +5 untyped bonus to a single skill.</p><p>Force Wizards are mean, and can compete at all levels, but in the upper tier they aren't nearly as devastating. Which I'm fine with. </p><p>The problem is that "secondary combat" characters drop off to "non-combat" characters despite having maintained their progressions. Take a look at Han Solo in the core book; he can barely hit himself, let alone Boba Fett.</p><p></p><p>Depends upon your players. I've known groups that I would give a Death Star to because they wouldn't rely upon it. And I've known players that giving their character <em>three</em> sticks and a rock is too much.</p><p>As far as running it goes, give them a squad / platoon / company of troopers to work with, and then make sure they know that that is <strong><em>it</em></strong>. Those are all the troops they'll get to play with, when not driving the boat, until they get back to base for a major refit. The Republic (Empire) has insane amounts of resources but even it has a) limited resources, b) very limited resources in any single location, c) a system that favors efficiency of action.</p><p>A side benefit is that you can actually work up backgrounds, names, personalities, and such for a small chunk of the crew and be done with it. Sure there are tens of thousands of crew but the players don't interact with <em>them</em>, they interact with their 10/50/100 trooper unit and the other 12 people in the command crew. </p><p>Bonus, the troopers are clones and will be very similar in large part. </p><p>Bonus two, it's one thing to sacrifice 'random trooper' to save yourself, it's a whole other thing to sacrifice B-115 "Bill", the guy that shot that Droidekka before it could smash your skull, to save yourself.</p><p></p><p>Sounds good to me.</p><p></p><p>If you're going to eliminate BAB, I'd go the other direction with it. Everyone gets +level to attacks, separating BAB from combat ability. Proficiency still negates the -5 penalty, stats still add. This means the combat classes rely upon their class feature (talents and feats) to kick butt, not their BAB because everyone is the same in that regard. And leave the +1/2 level to damage rolls.</p><p>Then again, it's not really a problem until level 13 or 14.</p><p></p><p>Yeah, stormtroopers, always allowing for exceptions, should pretty much just be at a certain level. If you want to differentiate you can have three Trooper stat blocks: Green, Seasoned, Veteran that would be something like Non-Heroic 4 / Soldier 1, Non-Heroic 4 / Soldier 3, Non-Heroic 4 / Soldier 3 / Scout 3. (Clone Troopers are pretty dang impressive, putting the Storm Troopers of a later era to shame.)</p><p>Simpler book-keeping, less build-work for you, and you can even mix it up in a single encounter to surprise your players.</p><p></p><p>Good luck.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ValhallaGH, post: 5032771, member: 41187"] You're welcome. Multi-class [I]should[/I] happen. Among other things, it's the only way to expand your class skill list (and therefore the list of skills you can take Skill Training in). The same thing that messes up low BAB characters: Defenses increase faster than their ability to hit those defenses (defenses increase +1 / level, Skills [UtF included] increase +1 / 2 levels, lesser BAB increases +3 / 4 levels or worse if you multi-class multiple 3/4 BAB classes). At level 14, minimum defenses (before Class, Ability, and Equipment bonuses) are 24. Most defenses are around 30. Most Force Wizards will be on a +21 or so (slowing down but still awesome), while a Dex 12 Noble will be on a +11 to hit, and a Dex 16 Noble 6 / Scoundrel 3 / Ace Pilot 5 will be on a +12 to hit. The way skills (especially UtF) work is that you are extremely front-loaded (+5 training, +5 focus, ~+3 ability = +13 at first level) but your progression is slow, eventually being matched or out-stripped by defenses (+16 level, +4 class bonus, +4 ability = 34 Defense [I]vs.[/I] +18 UtF = +5 training, +5 Focus, +8 1/2 level, +5 ability). Always excepting the Education Destiny and it's +5 untyped bonus to a single skill. Force Wizards are mean, and can compete at all levels, but in the upper tier they aren't nearly as devastating. Which I'm fine with. The problem is that "secondary combat" characters drop off to "non-combat" characters despite having maintained their progressions. Take a look at Han Solo in the core book; he can barely hit himself, let alone Boba Fett. Depends upon your players. I've known groups that I would give a Death Star to because they wouldn't rely upon it. And I've known players that giving their character [I]three[/I] sticks and a rock is too much. As far as running it goes, give them a squad / platoon / company of troopers to work with, and then make sure they know that that is [B][I]it[/I][/B]. Those are all the troops they'll get to play with, when not driving the boat, until they get back to base for a major refit. The Republic (Empire) has insane amounts of resources but even it has a) limited resources, b) very limited resources in any single location, c) a system that favors efficiency of action. A side benefit is that you can actually work up backgrounds, names, personalities, and such for a small chunk of the crew and be done with it. Sure there are tens of thousands of crew but the players don't interact with [I]them[/I], they interact with their 10/50/100 trooper unit and the other 12 people in the command crew. Bonus, the troopers are clones and will be very similar in large part. Bonus two, it's one thing to sacrifice 'random trooper' to save yourself, it's a whole other thing to sacrifice B-115 "Bill", the guy that shot that Droidekka before it could smash your skull, to save yourself. Sounds good to me. If you're going to eliminate BAB, I'd go the other direction with it. Everyone gets +level to attacks, separating BAB from combat ability. Proficiency still negates the -5 penalty, stats still add. This means the combat classes rely upon their class feature (talents and feats) to kick butt, not their BAB because everyone is the same in that regard. And leave the +1/2 level to damage rolls. Then again, it's not really a problem until level 13 or 14. Yeah, stormtroopers, always allowing for exceptions, should pretty much just be at a certain level. If you want to differentiate you can have three Trooper stat blocks: Green, Seasoned, Veteran that would be something like Non-Heroic 4 / Soldier 1, Non-Heroic 4 / Soldier 3, Non-Heroic 4 / Soldier 3 / Scout 3. (Clone Troopers are pretty dang impressive, putting the Storm Troopers of a later era to shame.) Simpler book-keeping, less build-work for you, and you can even mix it up in a single encounter to surprise your players. Good luck. [/QUOTE]
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