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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Pauper" data-source="post: 7419822" data-attributes="member: 17607">You're right, in 5E there isn't a 'surprise round' that functions differently than any other round of combat. In fact, the 5E rules for surprise explicitly allow individual creatures on each side of a combat to be surprised in the opening round, so the mechanics are pretty significantly different.Still, the term is used fairly commonly, so I doubt most players will be confused by it, particularly since, in this specific instance, the mechanics of the first round of combat do effectively mimic the 'surprise round' of previous editions. A good thing to keep in mind, though.Yes, I think this is Mistwell's point; the idea is that you know where a creature is if it "gives away its position". But I see two issues with that line of argument, which I'm guessing you'd agree with:First, a creature only "gives away its position" at the time it makes a disqualifying action (attacking, making noise, etc.). In the given example, the goblins easily could have attempted a Stealth (Dexterity) roll while moving after attacking to avoid giving away its movement; I'd argue that this is exactly what the DM in the example intended.Second, that a creature "gives away its position" still doesn't automatically mean you can see it. Given that the goblin in this situation was still in heavy concealment after making its attack means that, even though the PC knows where the goblin was, she still can't perceive the goblin using sight, so even if she can make an attack, she's still attacking with disadvantage for being unable to see the target.Agreed. At the very least, the DM should ask, "Are you searching for the goblin? That will use your action." If the PC doesn't wish to use her action, then she should not be upset if she doesn't get more information.--Pauper</blockquote>

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