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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Aegeri" data-source="post: 5230611" data-attributes="member: 78116">Actually it was in a published module I was running. I couldn't believe someone would ever actually use something like that for real! But they did. The point of the vampires was actually to capture the party - hence the sundering weapons - but it was still one of those things that was just really funny.I agree that's why common sense suggests that disarming = 0 HP.I've argued this every single time I've heard arguments about disarming come up. Disarm to me is 0 HP for a monster OR a PC. It represents an inability to fight any further and defend yourself (which is EXACTLY what allowing dominate to do by throwing away a PCs weapon does). I frankly don't see the need to allow dominate, already the most annoying and powerful condition in 4th edition arguably for players, to be an at-will I win button.The point is the game should be "What is good for the goose is good for the gander" as someone earlier in the thread commented on one of my posts. The inherent point here is that like many of these things, monsters do it far better than PCs and if the logical thing with dominate is to disarm and toss, then any intelligent monster should do that. Monsters dominate at-will, the terrain is always in their favor (immune to it, they can fly around it or whatever else) and any number of advantages. The fact is, I don't believe this is ever something that the dominate condition should allow to begin with. My reason for that is to maintain game balance but also pure common sense. It's not a case where the PCs can equally pick up a chair and throw it just as effectively as a monster, the PCs are punished immensely harshly while the monsters are barely punished at all in this situation. There is a degree where you have to say "This is not an intended part of the rules" and determine if you are going to allow that. Now if you're fine with it and you make a lot of weird restrictions on it to make it balanced, that's actually perfectly fine. The point is that this is all going to turn into some big comedic farce at some point as everyone is running around unable to do anything while they retrieve their weapons - because attacking with them is not as useful as effectively sticking your weapon into a dangerous zone, onto the middle of the huge or bigger creatures space (so the PC cannot retrieve it without provoking OAs or occupying the creatures space). It reminds me of the weirdo in Baldurs Gate 2 who bursts into temples and throws a scimitar at you. Maybe once for pure comedy effect, but after that it's not something I view as a RAW and valid way of using dominate.</blockquote>

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