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Message: <blockquote data-quote="wingsandsword" data-source="post: 1869425" data-attributes="member: 14159">I was talking about Heal as an offensive spell against living targets in 1e, not Harm.  As I said, I don't know about 1st Edition, and I don't have a copy of the books. I've just heard lots of stories from old-timers about killing Kobolds, 0 Level Commoners and 1st level Wizards with Heal spells because it supposedly put you 1d4 HP below your maximum so it could kill a target with 4 HP maximum or less. -10 was a not a core rule in 2nd Edition, it was a completely optional rule (which virtually everyone used), page 104 2nd Edition Dungeon Master's Guide (1995 printing).   Of course, it worked differently than it did in 3rd Edition, any Cure spell of any strength only brought the target to 1 HP, no higher, and he could not cast spells, run, attack or benefit from magical healing short of a Heal spell until he had a day of rest (but even with a Heal spell you still can't cast spells until you've rested for a day).  Now, every group I played with also ignored that part, and once you were in positive HP you were back in action and didn't lose spells memorized.</blockquote>