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Can Mirror Images Flank?
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<blockquote data-quote="Kae'Yoss" data-source="post: 314672" data-attributes="member: 4134"><p>Yes, but it won't grant you something that the spell is not meant to provide: You would speak to the public speaker without being heard by the crowd, like in the spell's description. This needs no save or SR, as it's only a means of communication. He won't be scared just because you spoke through magic instead of your mouth. For that, you would still need an intimidate check.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sure. That's well within the spell's possibilities! </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I don't say that there should be no such flexibility. I said that you can't do something that is well beyond the spell's power.</p><p></p><p>You could use prestidigitation to make poison taste and smell like fine mead. It's well within the spell's power, since you can flavor stuff. But if you did it and demanded that the drinker would not get his saving throw against the poison as he wouldn't fight the effects of mead, you'd get the big Munchkin Bane DM-Boot up where the sun don't shine! He would save the moment he feel his entrails want to crawl up his gullet! Because it can make it taste like mead, but as soon as it hits his stomach, it will ACT like poison.</p><p></p><p>If you use message to silently threaten someone else, it's fine. But if you insist that he must now be scared (as he gets no save and no SR), you better follow up with a fast "just kidding"! The spells delivers word, just like your mouth delivers words. You can accomplish nealy everything you can do if you speak with another (you could cheat at a game of poker if you stand behind your friend's enemy and tell your friend what cards his enemy has) but the spell won't do more (you probably couldn't convince the listener that you are his concience and that he wouldn't want to kill that guy in front of him, at least not with a bluff check with a high bonus to the other's sense motive check)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Often you can make life a lot of easier by asking yourself two little questions: "is that what the spell is meant for" and "would that mean giving the spell an effect that is far beyond his possiblities and level".</p><p></p><p>MI is meant as a defensive spell. It's not meant for an offensive manner, so I'd answer our first question with "no"</p><p>A 2nd-level spell that allows you to flank the enemy all alone AND prevents you from being hit most of the time is way to powerful, so the answer to our second question is "no" again.</p><p></p><p>So my advice is to let the spell be just a defensive spell.</p><p></p><p>And don't bother about where those mirror images are: it's unneccesary work.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kae'Yoss, post: 314672, member: 4134"] Yes, but it won't grant you something that the spell is not meant to provide: You would speak to the public speaker without being heard by the crowd, like in the spell's description. This needs no save or SR, as it's only a means of communication. He won't be scared just because you spoke through magic instead of your mouth. For that, you would still need an intimidate check. Sure. That's well within the spell's possibilities! I don't say that there should be no such flexibility. I said that you can't do something that is well beyond the spell's power. You could use prestidigitation to make poison taste and smell like fine mead. It's well within the spell's power, since you can flavor stuff. But if you did it and demanded that the drinker would not get his saving throw against the poison as he wouldn't fight the effects of mead, you'd get the big Munchkin Bane DM-Boot up where the sun don't shine! He would save the moment he feel his entrails want to crawl up his gullet! Because it can make it taste like mead, but as soon as it hits his stomach, it will ACT like poison. If you use message to silently threaten someone else, it's fine. But if you insist that he must now be scared (as he gets no save and no SR), you better follow up with a fast "just kidding"! The spells delivers word, just like your mouth delivers words. You can accomplish nealy everything you can do if you speak with another (you could cheat at a game of poker if you stand behind your friend's enemy and tell your friend what cards his enemy has) but the spell won't do more (you probably couldn't convince the listener that you are his concience and that he wouldn't want to kill that guy in front of him, at least not with a bluff check with a high bonus to the other's sense motive check) Often you can make life a lot of easier by asking yourself two little questions: "is that what the spell is meant for" and "would that mean giving the spell an effect that is far beyond his possiblities and level". MI is meant as a defensive spell. It's not meant for an offensive manner, so I'd answer our first question with "no" A 2nd-level spell that allows you to flank the enemy all alone AND prevents you from being hit most of the time is way to powerful, so the answer to our second question is "no" again. So my advice is to let the spell be just a defensive spell. And don't bother about where those mirror images are: it's unneccesary work. [/QUOTE]
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