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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Can Paladins/Rangers use scrolls at levels 1-3
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<blockquote data-quote="Arrowhawk" data-source="post: 6014230" data-attributes="member: 6679551"><p>I think it really hinges on how Spell Completion treats people without the ability to cast spells. The PF OGC talks about a "caster" in the Spell Completion section and they talk about a "user" in the Spell Trigger. </p><p></p><p>A compelling argument is that a 3rd level Paladin is not yet a "caster." More compelling is Skip Williams said that the effective caster level for spell completion for classes who can't yet cast spells is 0. <shrug></p><p></p><p> Actually, the Spell Trigger rules contradict this. The rules for Spell Trigger explicitly allows paladins to use wands at level 1, providing that the spell is on their spell list. </p><p></p><p>here's what it says:</p><p></p><p></p><p>Note the spell list requirement still applies and controls whether you can use the wand, ergo a Paladin has a spell list at level 1.</p><p></p><p> Exactly. This is why it's perplexing to me that so many people are convinced this is the case.</p><p></p><p>Whether it's balanced or not, I think Rangers and Paladins could use some move versatility in low levels. One of the purposes of the class is to offer utility over raw power and this enhances that.</p><p></p><p> I posed the question in a FAQ and Jason ???? a Lead Developer went with the "no caster levels does not mean 0" approach. I don't know if he saw Skips explicit statement on the subject, but being that he's Paizo, he many not care. I notice some of the posters of the boards got outraged that I would even mention Skip Williams. As if we all are going to pretend PF has nothing to do with 3.5 when it comes to understanding the rules that were taken verbatim from 3.5.</p><p></p><p>Once again <shrug>.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Arrowhawk, post: 6014230, member: 6679551"] I think it really hinges on how Spell Completion treats people without the ability to cast spells. The PF OGC talks about a "caster" in the Spell Completion section and they talk about a "user" in the Spell Trigger. A compelling argument is that a 3rd level Paladin is not yet a "caster." More compelling is Skip Williams said that the effective caster level for spell completion for classes who can't yet cast spells is 0. <shrug> Actually, the Spell Trigger rules contradict this. The rules for Spell Trigger explicitly allows paladins to use wands at level 1, providing that the spell is on their spell list. here's what it says: Note the spell list requirement still applies and controls whether you can use the wand, ergo a Paladin has a spell list at level 1. Exactly. This is why it's perplexing to me that so many people are convinced this is the case. Whether it's balanced or not, I think Rangers and Paladins could use some move versatility in low levels. One of the purposes of the class is to offer utility over raw power and this enhances that. I posed the question in a FAQ and Jason ???? a Lead Developer went with the "no caster levels does not mean 0" approach. I don't know if he saw Skips explicit statement on the subject, but being that he's Paizo, he many not care. I notice some of the posters of the boards got outraged that I would even mention Skip Williams. As if we all are going to pretend PF has nothing to do with 3.5 when it comes to understanding the rules that were taken verbatim from 3.5. Once again <shrug>. [/QUOTE]
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Can Paladins/Rangers use scrolls at levels 1-3
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