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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dannyalcatraz" data-source="post: 5142474" data-attributes="member: 19675">I'm aware of that- however, I'm working with the game's actual provided numbers, not reality.<img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Its not just the +2 in the context of races that don't get the bonus- as I've pointed out, its also the logical disconnect with other races that DO get the bonus.A Half-Orc, Human, Genasi and Longtooth Shifter all top out in mass under 230lbs on average, and some don't even hit 200lbs.  Meanwhile, the "hulking humanoid" Minotaurs (PHB3 p11), "strongly built" Dragonkind (PHB p35) and the "tall and massive" Goliaths (PHB2 p12) are not one bit stronger, despite all starting off at least at 280lbs and topping out well over 300lbs on average.What is that 70+ lbs?  Fat?  Hair?  In this context, the REAL bruisers are the lightweights who manage to fight far outside their weight class...I mean- Minotaurs USED to be as strong as or stronger than some Giants, right from the get-go.  Now?  They're exactly as powerful as Half-Orcs and have to gain XP before they can touch that level of power.Githzerai USED to be uncannily agile, beyond the grace of even the Elves.  Now, they're no different.(FWIW, I do think that a Str min as suggested by Dausuul would mitigate this to a certain extent...but doesn't quite solve it.)No, my point is that the fluff and mechanics are 1) out of synch with each other, and 2) were not so in previous editions' versions of these races, which 3) makes them a prime example of a tradeoff between balance and flavor/evocative elements, such as we have been describing.In order to make races like Minotaurs or the "Powerfully Built" Goliaths of previous editions balanced with the other PC races, their incredibly high Str or iconic racial abilities were stripped away from them.  A PC of neither race will outshine any of the other "strong" races when it comes to raw, brute strength or damage dealing.  Indeed, they cannot.I did read your sentences.  You gave no "at least for one character" type language qualifier.  It was a simple absolute.And the second sentence's use of "never" would eliminate the possibility of such a character's existence.For the record, I'm with you 100% on that second sentence- stats only tell part of the story.  They tell you about the PC's raw physical or mental potential, and nothing more.  Class and other choices represent the realization of that potential...or in some cases, the rejection of it.However, that PC's baseline stats have a contextual meaning- PC1 is "stronger than" PC2; PC3 is "more agile than" PC 4.  That doesn't mean that PC1 is by necessity the better Warrior or that PC3 is the better Rogue, just that they may have a bigger upside.</blockquote>

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